he left the devil like a Jewish banker, master of the whole situation

longxianchen

Senior Member
chinese
Hi, Merry Christmas
Here are some words from the novel Lady Chatterley's Lover(page 385, chapter 17) by Lawrence (planetebook,here):
(background: Connie was in Venice, together with her sister Hilda. The following was describing a gondolier, Daniele, who was real man as Mellors, and didn't prostitute himself.……)

He was a little wild, uncouth and proud. So he was hireling to the rather doggy Giovanni who was hireling again to two women. So it is! When Jesus refused the devil’s money, he left the devil like a Jewish banker(Jesus like a banker?), master of the whole situation.


The sentence in blue is very difficult for me.
I presume there must be a story in bible about the money legend. But who is the Jewish banker? And what does the whole situation refer to ?

Anyway, How should I understand it please?
Thank you in advance
 
Last edited:
  • natkretep

    Moderato con anima (English Only)
    English (Singapore/UK), basic Chinese
    I assume the reference is to the temptation of Jesus, but I'm not sure. See the account in Matthew 4:
    8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendour. 9 ‘All this I will give you,’ he said, ‘if you will bow down and worship me.’
    10 Jesus said to him, ‘Away from me, Satan! For it is written: “Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.”’
    Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 4 - New International Version - UK
    The narrator seems to suggest that Jesus was like a Jewish banker - not deceived by the devil and therefore in control of the situation.
     

    longxianchen

    Senior Member
    chinese
    Thank you.
    Jesus was like a Jewish banker - not deceived by the devil and therefore in control of the situation
    But was there a Jewish banker, who was in control the situation in western history?
    And it seems to me that the reference to Jesus has nothing to do with the previous sentences:
    He was a little wild, uncouth and proud. So he was hireling to the rather doggy Giovanni who was hireling again to two women. So it is!
     

    GreenWhiteBlue

    Senior Member
    USA - English
    I read it in a sense opposite to that of natkretep. I understand Daniele's thought to be this: Jesus refused the Devil's offer, but that left the Devil in control of the situation, in the same way that a wealthy Jewish banker controls a business transaction. Therefore, Daniele will not refuse wages even if they are "tainted" in some way by coming from the disreputable Giovanni, who in turn got the money from the two women.
     

    se16teddy

    Senior Member
    English - England
    But was there a Jewish banker, who was in control the situation in western history?
    I can't guarantee how true this is; but it is widely understood that in the early Middle Ages Christians were forbidden to collect interest on loans - this was the sin and crime of usury - and as a result Jews ran the banking industry.
     
    Last edited:

    natkretep

    Moderato con anima (English Only)
    English (Singapore/UK), basic Chinese
    I read it in a sense opposite to that of natkretep. I understand Daniele's thought to be this: Jesus refused the Devil's offer, but that left the Devil in control of the situation, in the same way that a wealthy Jewish banker controls a business transaction. Therefore, Daniele will not refuse wages even if they are "tainted" in some way by coming from the disreputable Giovanni, who in turn got the money from the two women.
    Sorry, now that I've re-read it, I'll now go with GreenWhiteBlue's reading. The devil is the Jewish banker.
     

    longxianchen

    Senior Member
    chinese
    I can't guarantee how true this is; but it is widely understood that in the early Middle Ages Christians were forbidden to collect interest on loans - this was the sin and crime of usury - and as a result Jews ran the banking industry.
    But Jews are also Christians:)
     

    natkretep

    Moderato con anima (English Only)
    English (Singapore/UK), basic Chinese
    Remember that a Christian is someone who accepts that Jesus is the Messiah or the Christ ('Messiah' is the Jewish term, 'Christ' is the Greek term: they mean the same thing). If Jews accept that Jesus is the Christ then they are Jewish Christians. The problem is that 'Jewish' can be used to refer to a person's race (Hebrew) as well as to a person's religion (Judaism). When we say 'Jew' or 'Jewish' on its own, we often mean a Jew who has not converted out of Judaism.
     

    RedwoodGrove

    Senior Member
    English, USA
    From what I've read, in the years following Jesus's death the apostles considered his teachings to apply only to Jews. I think it was Peter who had a vision that they should apply to all people. Then Paul was really the steward of broadening the message, starting mainly in Antioch (modern day Turkey). Things were really different back then. Jews were not allowed to eat or sleep in a gentile's house according to their own laws, or so I've read. If I'm wrong about this I welcome correction. Of course people broke the rules. One of the Roman governors was married to a Jewish woman. The Romans were in charge of the territory.
     

    longxianchen

    Senior Member
    chinese
    8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendour. 9 ‘All this I will give you,’ he said, ‘if you will bow down and worship me.’
    10 Jesus said to him, ‘Away from me, Satan! For it is written: “Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.”’
    OK.Jesus left all the kingdoms of the world and their splendour(=the whole situation) in the control of the devil
    it is widely understood that in the early Middle Ages Christians were forbidden to collect interest on loans - this was the sin and crime of usury - and as a result Jews ran the banking industry
    Very useful for me.:thumbsup:
    I understand Daniele's thought to be this: Jesus refused the Devil's offer, but that left the Devil in control of the situation, in the same way that a wealthy Jewish banker controls a business transaction. Therefore, Daniele will not refuse wages even if they are "tainted" in some way by coming from the disreputable Giovanni, who in turn got the money from the two women.
    Very good:thumbsup:
     
    Last edited:

    longxianchen

    Senior Member
    chinese
    Now, I feel it's very possible that Lawrence made a conclusion: even Jesus had failed to change people's greed for money, and now the world is being controlled by devil/money.:D
     
    < Previous | Next >
    Top