Hindi, Urdu: mortal

MonsieurGonzalito

Senior Member
Castellano de Argentina
Friends,

How does one say "mortals" in the sense of all mankind as opposed to gods, etc.?
(I know that this might not apply to all religions, as some gods are in fact finite, but you get the idea).

Also, can it be used as a noun?

For example, how would you say: "Zeus loves the mortals". ?

My attempt:

ziiuz nashvar(oN) se pyar karte haiN

(BTW, I can't find "nashvar" in Urdu dictionaries, I am pointed to "nushvar". Only Platts has it, referring to "nusvar" as the more vulgar form).

 
  • desi4life

    Senior Member
    English
    The “vulgar” form of nashvar isn’t nusvar, but rather nasvar. In Hindi, nashvar (regional: nasvar) and naashvaan/naashmaan (regional: naasvaan/naasmaan) are used for mortal (perishable) as an adjective. The more common term in Urdu is faanii. However, in your sentence mortals is a noun that’s equivalent in meaning to human beings, so a word such as insaan/insaanoN would fit.

    Edit: There is also martya in Hindi, meaning mortal, and used as an adjective and noun. Another word that can mean mortal (deadly) and used as an adjective is jaanii as in jaanii dushman (mortal/deadly enemy).
     
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    littlepond

    Senior Member
    Hindi
    And in some contexts, such as mortal remains, mortal body, etc. - "paarthiv" (literally meaning "earthly").

    From Dasa:
    पार्थिव pārthiva वि० [सं०] १. पृथिवी संबंधी । २. पृथ्वी से उप्तन्न । पृथिवी का विकार रूप । जैसे, पार्थिव शरीर । ३. मिट्टी आदि का बना हुआ । ४. संसारिक । संसार संबंधी (को०) । ५. राजा के योग्य । राजसी । ६. पृथिवी का शासक (को०) ।

    Do note that "mortal" is not as favourite a word in the Hindi landscape as "mortal" is in the some of the European languages' landscape, and I guess the reason could be the obsession with loss and death in Christianity-influenced cultures.
     

    aevynn

    Senior Member
    USA
    English, Hindustani
    I can't find "nashvar" in Urdu dictionaries
    Here's naswar, and the definition includes the word nashwar.

    can it be used as a noun?
    nashwar is in fact sometimes used as a substantive (eg, in Krishna Sobti's Samay Sargam, one finds anashwar se sabhii nashwaroN ko ek mohlat miltii hai yahaaN rahne kii, rukne kii). So the translation of your sample sentence is fine (a bit abrupt perhaps, but then so is the original English you're translating from?). On the other hand, I don't know that faanii is used as a substantive (eg, it sounds odd to me to say *faaniyoN ko ek mohlat miltii hai...), but you could perhaps try something like faanii maxluuq or fanaa-paziir maxluuq or something along those lines. In a nazm by Hafeez Jalandhari commemorating Iqbal, one finds:
    wo ik faanii bashar thaa maiN ye baawar kar nahiiN saktaa​
    bashaar iqbaal ho jaa'e to hargiz mar nahiiN saktaa​

    It may also be worth pointing out that neither faanii nor nashwar is exactly like English "mortal." The former can be used to talk about things being transitory even if they can't literally die. For instance, you can say things like nashwar duniyaa to express that the world is transitory, even though the world might not literally die. On the other hand, if I were to say "the mortal world" in English, my understanding of this phrase is not that the world itself will/must die. Rather, I understand this phrase to mean the world belonging to mortal beings (or the world in which mortal beings live, etc). In other words, to me it seems like the word "mortal" in the phrase "the mortal world" is forced into it's usage as a noun rather than as an attributive adjective, and the phrase becomes a genitive tatpuruṣa, presumably because it doesn't make sense to talk about the world literally dying? Similarly, you can say duniyaa kii har chiiz faanii hai, but in English, "?All things in the world are mortal" is semantically a little questionable to me.
     
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    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    Here's naswar, and the definition includes the word nashwar.


    nashwar is in fact sometimes used as a substantive (eg, in Krishna Sobti's Samay Sargam, one finds anashwar se sabhii nashwaroN ko ek mohlat miltii hai yahaaN rahne kii, rukne kii). So the translation of your sample sentence is fine (a bit abrupt perhaps, but then so is the original English you're translating from?). On the other hand, I don't know that faanii is used as a substantive (eg, it sounds odd to me to say *faaniyoN ko ek mohlat miltii hai...), but you could perhaps try something like faanii maxluuq or fanaa-paziir maxluuq or something along those lines. In a nazm by Hafeez Jalandhari commemorating Iqbal, one finds:
    wo ik faanii bashar thaa maiN ye baawar kar nahiiN saktaa​
    bashaar iqbaal ho jaa'e to hargiz mar nahiiN saktaa​

    It may also be worth pointing out that neither faanii nor nashwar is exactly like English "mortal." The former can be used to talk about things being transitory even if they can't literally die. For instance, you can say things like nashwar duniyaa to express that the world is transitory, even though the world might not literally die. On the other hand, if I were to say "the mortal world" in English, my understanding of this phrase is not that the world itself will/must die. Rather, I understand this phrase to mean the world belonging to mortal beings (or the world in which mortal beings live, etc). In other words, to me it seems like the word "mortal" in the phrase "the mortal world" is forced into it's usage as a noun rather than as an attributive adjective, and the phrase becomes a genitive tatpuruṣa, presumably because it doesn't make sense to talk about the world literally dying? Similarly, you can say duniyaa kii har chiiz faanii hai, but in English, "?All things in the world are mortal" is semantically a little questionable to me.
    faanii - fanaa hone vaalaa; baanii = bunyaad rakhne vaalaa; saanii = duusre number par aane vaalaa; zaanii = zinaa karne vaalaa

    baanii > baaniyoN ne

    zaanii > zaaniyoN ko

    So, I would say "faanioN" is possible.

    جن جن کے تو مزار سے گزرا وہ جی اٹھے
    باقی رہے ہیں ایک ترے فانیوں میں ہم

    مصطفیٰ خان شیفتہ ( شاگرد مرزا غالب)

    jin jin ke tuu mazaar se guzraa vuh jii uThe
    baaqii rahe haiN ek tire faaniyoN meN ham

    Mustafa Khan Shefta (A "shaagird" of Mirza Ghalib)
     

    littlepond

    Senior Member
    Hindi
    I was wondering if the word "aalamii" would work as a noun for mortals in Urdu? @Qureshpor jii?
    (In Hindi, "aalam" itself is common--but mostly to describe "state, condition," not for "world"--but I haven't heard "aalamii.")
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I was wondering if the word "aalamii" would work as a noun for mortals in Urdu? @Qureshpor jii?
    (In Hindi, "aalam" itself is common--but mostly to describe "state, condition," not for "world"--but I haven't heard "aalamii.")
    littlepond Jii, the word 3aalam in Urdu is multi-faceted and its most common meanings are "world", "creation", "time/season" and "state/situation". To answer your question "3aalamii" would not imply "mortal" but say in "3aalamii xabreN", it would mean "world news".
     

    littlepond

    Senior Member
    Hindi
    littlepond Jii, the word 3aalam in Urdu is multi-faceted and its most common meanings are "world", "creation", "time/season" and "state/situation". To answer your question "3aalamii" would not imply "mortal" but say in "3aalamii xabreN", it would mean "world news".

    Thanks for the reply! "Mortal" as adjective in English can also mean "worldly, earthly": for example, "mortal concerns" and "mortal joys" (the latter is not much used, though there's a popular Christian hymn that uses those words). Even there, would one not be able to use "aalamii"?
     
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