"In whole Europe" or "in the whole Europe"?

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Paperita

Senior Member
Italian
"I think London is the best city in whole Europe"
or
"I think London is the best city in the whole Europe".
I can't decide if I should use the definite article the in such a sentence. I think the second is the best choice, but I would like to make sure.
Can you help me?
 
  • Parla

    Member Emeritus
    English - US
    Neither is correct, Paperita; Dn88 (post #2) has it right. You could also say: I think London is the best city in all of Europe.
     

    panjandrum

    Lapsed Moderator
    English-Ireland (top end)
    I agree with dn88 and Parla, in principle, but why is "all of" or "the whole of" needed?

    I think London is the best city in Europe.

    (I don't, of course, but that's irrelevant.)

    What additional meaning is conveyed by adding "all of" or "the whole of"?
     

    morzh

    Banned
    USA
    Russian
    Intensification of the statement? Perhaps? It does not carry any informational load, for sure, but I saw it used.

    In a similar fashion, saying "the best in the world" certainly does not need "whole" in it - we only have one (known) world, and no "part" is mentioned, but many will say "the best in the whole world".
     

    Paperita

    Senior Member
    Italian
    Ok, bu this increases my confusion.
    Why do we say:
    "in the whole of Europe"
    but
    "in the whole world" and not "in the whole of the world"?
    By the way, I think it's not correct to say "the best city of Europe". I always say "the best city in Europe". But I often heard "of" in this sentence. Am I right?
     

    Vektus

    Senior Member
    Russian
    I'm joining the question. Is there any rule in using "of" after "the whole"?

    We say: "the whole of the audience" but "the whole day". I've realized it just now and it confuses me :)
     

    Loob

    Senior Member
    English UK
    I'm joining the question. Is there any rule in using "of" after "the whole"?

    We say: "the whole of the audience" but "the whole day". I've realized it just now and it confuses me :)
    You can say "the whole audience" and "the whole of the day" as well:).

    But you can't use "the whole" (without "of") with 'proper nouns' like Europe:

    The whole of the continent of Europe
    :tick:
    The whole of Europe:tick:
    The whole continent of Europe:tick:
    The whole Europe.:cross:

    In the blue sentences "whole" is an adjective. And because we don't say "the Europe", we don't say "the {adjective} Europe".
     

    Paperita

    Senior Member
    Italian
    So, you are saying that I should use
    - the whole + noun (the whole world, the whole city, the whole story, the whole universe)
    - the whole of + proper noun (the whole of Europe, the whole of London, the whole of the Mediterranean Sea)?
     

    se16teddy

    Senior Member
    English - England
    Most place names don't use the. You can't say the Europe and you can't say the whole Europe.

    Some place names do use the. You say the Isle of Wight and you can say the whole Isle of Wight.

    The adjective whole is not used before a singular noun except where there is an article. The same goes for entire and complete. I suppose that this is because, when we use a noun without an article, wholeness is implicit. If there is no wholeness, you need an article.

    I like whole apples. :tick:
    I like whole apple. :cross:
    I like a whole apple. :tick:
    I like Europe. :tick:
    I like whole Europe. :cross:

    Where you can't use the adjective whole, you can sometimes use the noun whole instead.

    I like the whole of Europe. :tick:
     
    Last edited:

    Paperita

    Senior Member
    Italian
    Thank you, but the question was not about the use of the article before place nouns. I was wondering if and when I have to use "of" after "whole".
    But, what does "I like whole apples" mean?
     

    pwmeek

    Senior Member
    English - American
    Thank you, but the question was not about the use of the article before place nouns. I was wondering if and when I have to use "of" after "whole".
    But, what does "I like whole apples" mean?
    You must use of after "whole" in all cases of this sort of construction where you are using "whole of" as an intensifier for a region. (I would never read such a construction to mean "including outlying areas".) Of would be optional after "all" for this use, but I would prefer it. Perhaps the phrases are more a sort of decoration than an intensification. Whole of Europe and all [of] Europe seem grander or more elegant than merely "Europe". Flowery speech.

    Whole apples is a different case. In this case it means "in one original piece; unsliced; not peeled", and "whole" simply modifies "apples".
    If you intended to mean "all kinds of" or "all varieties of" you should say so.
     
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