1. GeriReshef

    GeriReshef Senior Member

    Israel
    Hebrew
    In the article Bernardo de la Torre in the English Wikipedia I've found the following sentence:

    According to some sources, Bernardo de la Torre was the person who changed the name of what used to be known as Islas de Poniente ("Islands towards the West") to Felipinas or Philippines..

    What is the reason to this translation (why not "West Islands"?) and what is the reason the Spanish term lacks the article (why not "Islas del Poniente"?).

    From some discussions here I was impressed that today the term "poniente" may be treated as an archaic and literary in some places, and as a popular in others; but the questions implicitly refers to its meaning in the peninsular Spanish of the 16th century.
     
  2. Glyndon

    Glyndon Senior Member

    Canada
    English
    Perhaps to honour the then king Felipe II, I am not certain
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2016
  3. SydLexia Senior Member

    London, EU
    UK English
    Mainly because of Felipe II but also perhaps because they are in the East rather than in the West, from a European point of view.

    syd
     
  4. SkintheGoat

    SkintheGoat Senior Member

    Dublin
    English (Hibernian)
    Bear in mind that Wikipedia is an informal source of information to which anyone may contribute, and is not subject to any great degree of academic rigour. It's an excellent starting point for any investigation, but standards of expression and grammar, as of accuracy, may vary.
     
  5. GeriReshef

    GeriReshef Senior Member

    Israel
    Hebrew
    Thank you all for your useful contributions!
    • Glyndon: My question refers to the name of the Islas de Poniente and not to the name of the philippines.
    • Sydlexia: My question refers to the way the name (Islas de Poniente) was translated into English, and not to its reason.
    • SkintheGoat: That's true, but unfortunately WordReference is an informal source of information too, and one may even get here answers irrelevant to his question..
     
  6. Glyndon

    Glyndon Senior Member

    Canada
    English
    I do not have a full answer to your question. The best I can do is this: "en dirección poniente" = towards the west, where the sun sets, you do not say: en dirección del sol poniente.
     
  7. Ferrol Senior Member

    Bilbao
    Spanish.España
    Poniente es otra forma , menos usual, de decir "Oeste".Quizás era de uso más frecuente en aquellos tiempos
    Islas de Poniente es Islas del Oeste o Occidentales o Western Islands
    No se dice del Poniente/Oriente sino "de"
     
  8. GeriReshef

    GeriReshef Senior Member

    Israel
    Hebrew
    Ferrol - ¿Se puede decir "Islas del Oeste" pero no "Islas del Poniente"?
    ¿Poniente es una palabra que no obtiene el artículo?
     
  9. Glyndon

    Glyndon Senior Member

    Canada
    English
    The word "poniente" even though it refers geographically to "the west", is essentially "the direction where the sun sets" even though we now think about it in terms of "west." It's ancient meaning was just a direction, not a compass point. Hence, the word "de" without the article.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2016
  10. Ferrol Senior Member

    Bilbao
    Spanish.España
    No.Islas del poniente , suena raro
    The scholarly post above by Glyndon explains us both why
    Thank you Glyndon.I had no idea
     
  11. Glyndon

    Glyndon Senior Member

    Canada
    English
    Thank you Ferrol, I think "scholarly" is a bit of a stretch .... :oops:
     
  12. Ferrol Senior Member

    Bilbao
    Spanish.España
    By no means mate!.I was not piling it on
     
  13. Glyndon

    Glyndon Senior Member

    Canada
    English
  14. GeriReshef

    GeriReshef Senior Member

    Israel
    Hebrew
    Thank you Glyndon: I think I understand it now!
     
  15. sinderik Senior Member

    Spanish - España
    La historia es más o menos así:

    W nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnE

    islands_________________<-guy in a boat_________________________Mexico
     
  16. Glyndon

    Glyndon Senior Member

    Canada
    English
    With pleasure. Shalom.
     
  17. sinderik Senior Member

    Spanish - España
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2016

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