Knead into dough

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Hotmale

Senior Member
Polish
Hi,
Could you tell me if me sentence is correct? "Knead the ingredients into dough."

Thank you
 
  • Nunty

    Senior Member
    Hebrew-US English (bilingual)
    There are two possiblities that I can think of. One is that after the list of ingredients (flour, eggs, yeast, oil, apple juice, whatever) there is the instruction "Knead into dough." The other is that you have already prepared the dough and are now adding nuts and raisins, in which case I would expect the recipe to say "knead into the dough".

    I don't really see a case in which the recipe would tell me "knead into a dough".
     

    elroy

    Imperfect Mod
    US English, Palestinian Arabic bilingual
    But Nun-Translator, "knead into dough" is not a complete sentence; it is typical space-saving recipe-talk. If you were to write out the whole sentence it would be "knead into a dough."

    Even "knead into the dough" can be shortened to "knead into dough" in recipe-talk, if at that point it's assumed that you already have a dough.
     

    Nunty

    Senior Member
    Hebrew-US English (bilingual)
    You're right, of course, if we're if we're talking about something that is not a recipe. I guess I made the (unwarranted?) assumption that dough-kneading was necessarily recipe-talk.

    Even though the second case could be shortened that way, in my experience it usually is not.

    So, Hotmale, if you're not writing a recipe, forget everything I said. :)
     

    Nunty

    Senior Member
    Hebrew-US English (bilingual)
    And even so, I had another thought.

    Is "dough" a countable noun? How many doughs did you make today? :eek:

    I'm pretty thoroughly confused now, but not at all convinced about that indefinite article. :confused:
     

    elroy

    Imperfect Mod
    US English, Palestinian Arabic bilingual
    "How many doughs?" - no
    "Knead into a dough." - yes

    Hm...I'm trying to explain why, but I can't. It's just intuitive.
     

    Nunty

    Senior Member
    Hebrew-US English (bilingual)
    Oh no! If Elroy can't explain we are in deep waters, indeed... ;) I hope someone can (and will) explain because I am lost and the question is taking up more of my brain space than I can easily afford.
     

    elroy

    Imperfect Mod
    US English, Palestinian Arabic bilingual
    Ah! "Paste"!

    That's the example I was trying to think of but couldn't.

    You can say "mix into a paste" but you can't - usually - say "how many pastes."

    When you tell somebody to do something to a bunch of ingredients that will convert them into a certain form, you can use the indefinite article to describe that form, even if the resultant form is traditionally an uncountable noun.

    Is that a good explanation? :rolleyes:
     

    Nunty

    Senior Member
    Hebrew-US English (bilingual)
    Ah! "Paste"!

    That's the example I was trying to think of but couldn't.

    You can say "mix into a paste" but you can't - usually - say "how many pastes."

    When you tell somebody to do something to a bunch of ingredients that will convert them into a certain form, you can use the indefinite article to describe that form, even if the resultant form is traditionally an uncountable noun.
    Ah! Now that I understand. Thank you.

    Is that a good explanation? :rolleyes:
    Ummm... may I take the fifth? :rolleyes:
     

    . 1

    Banned
    Australian Australia
    May I add my tuppence worth.
    This may be a specialised thing with dough being part of cooking jargon.
    Cooking has been a large factor in our language development.
    Many recipes have been handed down over the years and most of those have ommitted 'a' and 'the' and other similar words.
    Native English speakers can remember cooks reading from cookery books so it sounds fine in the contracted form.
    I contend that the correct form is to knead into a dough when making dough and knead into the dough when adding ingredients to a prepared dough.

    To answer Our Sister,
    I think that you are correct that dough is not a countable noun and you would say how much dough is there.

    .,,
     

    Anais Ninn

    Senior Member
    Korean
    It's good to learn something new but this worries me a great deal. :eek: It seems that nun-translator finally got it but I don't know if I will ever be able to use articles with confidence now. :( When can we say "a dough" except for "kneading into a dough"? :confused: Can someone provide me with more examples?

    Thanks!

    Anais


    May I add my tuppence worth.
    This may be a specialised thing with dough being part of cooking jargon.
    Cooking has been a large factor in our language development.
    Many recipes have been handed down over the years and most of those have ommitted 'a' and 'the' and other similar words.
    Native English speakers can remember cooks reading from cookery books so it sounds fine in the contracted form.
    I contend that the correct form is to knead into a dough when making dough and knead into the dough when adding ingredients to a prepared dough.

    To answer Our Sister,
    I think that you are correct that dough is not a countable noun and you would say how much dough is there.

    .,,
     

    elroy

    Imperfect Mod
    US English, Palestinian Arabic bilingual
    "That's a nice dough you've got there."

    That's something you could say to a hardworking chef who's just kneaded his ingredients into a dough. ;)

    It's a little different, but it's the same idea.
     

    Anais Ninn

    Senior Member
    Korean
    I would say "That's some nice dough you've got there." I thought about the reason. I suspect that it might be my subconscious attempt to avoid a vs. no-article problem.

    Would you also say "that's a soup you've got there."? (I would say "that's some soup you've got there.")

    Thanks!

    Anais


    "That's a nice dough you've got there."

    That's something you could say to a hardworking chef who's just kneaded his ingredients into a dough. ;)

    It's a little different, but it's the same idea.
     

    elroy

    Imperfect Mod
    US English, Palestinian Arabic bilingual
    You're right, but I think you can use the indefinite article in the recently-converted-mass context. :)
     

    Anais Ninn

    Senior Member
    Korean
    Bwaaaaaa... Your last sentence's making me cry. I guess I have no choice but just to try to get the feel of it. :( Thank you for trying to help me figure this out, elroy!

    Anais

    You're right, but I think you can use the indefinite article in the recently-converted-mass context. :)
     

    Victoria32

    Senior Member
    English (UK) New Zealand
    And even so, I had another thought.

    Is "dough" a countable noun? How many doughs did you make today? :eek:

    I'm pretty thoroughly confused now, but not at all convinced about that indefinite article. :confused:
    99.9% of the time, I would avoid any article as it is correct to say it's a mass noun... non-countable.
    I would say "That's some nice dough you've got there." I thought about the reason. I suspect that it might be my subconscious attempt to avoid a vs. no-article problem.

    Would you also say "that's a soup you've got there."? (I would say "that's some soup you've got there.")

    Thanks!

    Anais
    "That's a soup you've got there", is a sentence you could use in argument, if the other person was insisting that she was making a stew or casserole but what she had more too liquid. Otherwise, you'd just say "that's soup you've got there, probably with something added, such as "is it nice?" Or "what kind is it?"

    VL
     
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