Müde in English? What Germanic/IE roots refer to tiredness?

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ThomasK

Senior Member
Belgium, Dutch
Dutch and German share "müde"/ "moe" (moede is the original form), but does that m root appear in English, be it with another meaning?

There is '"weary" in English, but does the root turn up in German or Dutch, do you think?

"Fatigue" refers to tiredness too but there is little etymological information available on the root, though I wonder whether there could not be a link with "satis" when I read that the "fat-" refers to something like 'sufficient(ly)"...
 
  • berndf

    Moderator
    German (Germany)
    The modern English word ‘mood’ is cognate with the German and Dutch words.
    Indirectly yes. Mood is a direct cognate of German Mut, Dutch moed = courage. Originally, and still in some dialects, the English word had this meaning, too What ties the noun and the adjective together semantically seems to be the past participle of a verbal root meaning making an endeavour (c.f. German mühen), i.e. having made an endeavour, which shows you have spirit and courage and leaves you tired.
     

    ThomasK

    Senior Member
    Belgium, Dutch
    Very interesting. Had already been wondering about the link between mood/ moed, but none of the etymological sites iI use (etymonline.com, etymologiebank.nl, dwds.de) refers to that as far as I can see. Is your information based on other sites or dictionaries?

    Oh, and: @berndf: why do you call the link "indirect"? Because of the semantic evolution?
     

    berndf

    Moderator
    German (Germany)
    Very interesting. Had already been wondering about the link between mood/ moed, but none of the etymological sites iI use (etymonline.com, etymologiebank.nl, dwds.de) refers to that as far as I can see. Is your information based on other sites or dictionaries?
    Yes, DWDS does:
    müde Adj. ‘abgespannt, schlafbedürftig’, Anord. mōðr, dän. (älter) mod sind mit dem Partizipialsuffix ie. -to-, die westgerm. Formen ahd. muodi (8. Jh.), mhd. müede, muode, asächs. mōði, mnd. mȫde, mnl. moede, nl. moede, aengl. mēþe dagegen mit dem zuweilen partizipialen Charakter tragenden Suffix ie. -ti̯o- gebildet (germ. *mōþija-). Zu ie. *mō- (s. ↗mühen) gehörig, ist müde daher als ‘sich gemüht habend, abgemüht’ zu verstehen. ermüden Vb. ‘müde, abgespannt werden, müde machen’, ahd. irmuodēn (11. Jh.; doch vgl. unirmuodēntlīh, 9. Jh.), mhd. ermüeden (nur intransitiv), zum Simplex mhd. müeden ‘müde machen, werden’. Müdigkeit f. ‘Abgespanntheit, Mattigkeit’, mhd. müedecheit.

    Oh, and: @berndf: why do you call the link "indirect"? Because of the semantic evolution?
    Because one is a derived adjective and the other a derived noun. The direct OE cognate above did not survive into ME.
     
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    Abaye

    Senior Member
    Hebrew
    Very interesting. Had already been wondering about the link between mood/ moed, but none of the etymological sites iI use (etymonline.com, etymologiebank.nl, dwds.de) refers to that as far as I can see. Is your information based on other sites or dictionaries?
    That's the first result in my Google for "mood etymology": "mood: Old English mōd (also in the senses ‘mind’ and ‘fierce courage’), of Germanic origin; related to Dutch moed and German Mut".

    Added: see also Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/mōdaz - Wiktionary
     
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    aruniyan

    Senior Member
    Tamil
    "Fatigue" refers to tiredness too but there is little etymological information available on the root, though I wonder whether there could not be a link with "satis" when I read that the "fat-" refers to something like 'sufficient(ly)"...
    Fatigue could be related to Fade Latin *fatidus,?

    In Tamil there is Vaadu, means 'to wither out', like a plant withering.
    In Sanskrit there is VAta hurt.
     

    ThomasK

    Senior Member
    Belgium, Dutch
    Thanks a lot. I might venture upon a Googhle etymology search from time to time. I had my favourites, but maybe I can search broader!
    Fatigue could be related to Fade Latin *fatidus,?

    In Tamil there is Vaadu, means 'to wither out', like a plant withering.
    In Sanskrit there is VAta hurt.
    I had been wondering if the -d of fatidus would not constitute a problem. I guess the Latin fatiga is much more likely a suggestion.

    But then literally you say that you feel "withered out" when you feel tired - or rather when you feel exhausted. Is vaadu the most common word for "tired"?
     

    aruniyan

    Senior Member
    Tamil
    Thanks a lot. I might venture upon a Googhle etymology search from time to time. I had my favourites, but maybe I can search broader!
    I had been wondering if the -d of fatidus would not constitute a problem. I guess the Latin fatiga is much more likely a suggestion.

    But then literally you say that you feel "withered out" when you feel tired - or rather when you feel exhausted. Is vaadu the most common word for "tired"?
    Not sure, but just asked if the "fati" in both the words could be from the same source.


    About Tamil word, Vaadu/Vaattu used in "visibly" drowned cases,
    like a plant's stem and leaves not in good strength or shape, a person looks visibly broken, lost shape.
    For Tired theres another word chOrvu/sOrvu, its like draining off, loosing away energy.
     
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