Nie dodawaj mi win

CarlitosMS

Senior Member
Spanish - Spain
Hello

I would like to know what this sentence means, since literally, "don't add me faults/guilts" doesn't sound natural.

Greetings
 
  • CarlitosMS

    Senior Member
    Spanish - Spain
    Thank you very much for your kind answer.

    I tried to find "dodawać win" in dictionaries and found nothing. Is it normal?
     

    BezierCurve

    Senior Member
    It's "Dodawać winy" but "Nie dodawać win" (genitive with negation, a peculiar grammar feature). Majlo, I don't think I've ever used that expression myself, but think of "To nie ja byłam Ewą...".
     

    ymar

    Member
    Polish
    Why would anybody want to learn a language from song lyrics? It's a bad idea. Read novels, poetry. But pop songs? They are written to make money, not to make sense. Songwriters will use expressions no one else uses and no one appreciates. They can do it because no one cares.
     

    BezierCurve

    Senior Member
    ... yet songs are a great source of vocabulary and idiomatic expressions. While their grammar can be dodgy, I wouldn't discourage anyone from memorizing single words and expressions from songs.
     

    ymar

    Member
    Polish
    Yeah, right, that's a great idea. Don't learn from songs, but learn from poetry. Come on. ;)
    Not all kinds of poetry are suitable for learning, but some are. No kind of pop songs is suitable for learning in my opinion, except what BezierCurve said. Analyzing the grammar and phraseology of Adam Mickiewicz or Czesław Miłosz will help your own grammar and phraseology considersably. Analyzing Ewa Farna (or whoever writes those lyrics) won't help you enough to balance the time and the effort you'll have put into it. It simply doesn't pay off. As I said in another post, I recommend the following procedure. When you see in a song an expression you don't understand, use your dictionaries and brain. If this fails, just let it go, because the chance it's something worthwhile is small (unless you have a valid reason to think otherwise of course). If you find yourself in the same situation while reading a recognized piece of literature, dig as deep as you can, because you are about to learn something. In legal terms, I recommend applying a strong presumption of guilt to the expressions coming from pop songs and a strong presumption of innocence to those coming from good literature.
     
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    Trimm

    New Member
    polish
    I think that polish is a quite flexible language that is the best noticeable in poetry. Sometimes even Polish can't understand the correct meaning of some words which are completely not used in the daily life. This phrase, "nie dodawaj mi win" sounds in polish the same unnaturally as the literal english translation. Though I understand the meaning of it, I have never heard it before. And - I don't think that poetry is a good way to learn polish. Polish people learn English from movies with the original, english sound - it could be good also for foreigners, who want to speak colloquial polish.
     

    ymar

    Member
    Polish
    I think that polish is a quite flexible language that is the best noticeable in poetry. Sometimes even Polish can't understand the correct meaning of some words which are completely not used in the daily life. This phrase, "nie dodawaj mi win" sounds in polish the same unnaturally as the literal english translation. Though I understand the meaning of it, I have never heard it before. And - I don't think that poetry is a good way to learn polish. Polish people learn English from movies with the original, english sound - it could be good also for foreigners, who want to speak colloquial polish.
    The fact that "nie dodawaj mi win" sounds awkward simply indicates that this is not good poetry. Bad poetry is bad for a learner, true. Good poetry will help you. Not that you need it, no. You may well master a language without reading a single poem. But reading good poems will improve your general understanding of the language and if you like this way, there's no reason not to go for it. There is however a good reason not to bother trying to analyze the language of bad poetry and pop songs too deeply. It will make you waste your time and oftentimes lead you astray.
     
    Good poetry could help a learner just as well as good lyrics of a pop song could. However, I would always advise against learning a language from poetry, because that's not the language that is used in everyday speech! (Not to mention the fact that poetry is simply boring for most people) What I would always advise is watching films with the original audio and subtitles in the given language, listening to the radio and reading newspapers.

    By the way, ymar, why do you quote Trimm's post if you're responding directly below?
     

    ymar

    Member
    Polish
    Sorry, it's a habit from another forum. People post there very often and it's necessary to avoid confusion when several people post at once.

    Reading good poetry in a language we are learning gives us several things, depending on the kind of poetry. Obviously, if you want to learn only colloquial Polish, there is probably no point in reading Bogurodzica. One is very far from the other. However, we can easily find much closer matches. A person who wants to achieve mastery in most registers of the Polish language will find it very instructive to read Herbert, Miłosz, Mickewicz and even Leśmian. They will find articulate sentences and correct phraseology in some poems and get a feel of Polish word-formation in others. As I said, this is not necessary, but it won't harm your improvement. You won't use many of these expressions. But you will have learned something about the language. Note that good poetry is good for a reason. It is good because it sounded right to many native speakers. You can't go wrong with that. Be reasonable, don't try to show off your newly obtained knowledge and you'll be well off. I tried it with English and I consider myself well off.

    As for good pop song lyrics, well, I agree that this exists. The problem is how one can recognize it. The general rule seems to be, "If it sounds good to a native ear, it's good for you in this or another way." The learner may not have a native ear at hand, unfortunately. I'm sure you actually agree that strong skepticism is strongly recommended.

    What I'm saying is based on my own learning experience and experiences from various langugage forums. I see learners trying to make sense of pieces of lousy lyrics in English all the time. They write tens of posts and all they get is irritation of answerers and tiredness for themselves.
     

    CarlitosMS

    Senior Member
    Spanish - Spain
    Sorry, it's a habit from another forum. People post there very often and it's necessary to avoid confusion when several people post at once.

    Reading good poetry in a language we are learning gives us several things, depending on the kind of poetry. Obviously, if you want to learn only colloquial Polish, there is probably no point in reading Bogurodzica. One is very far from the other. However, we can easily find much closer matches. A person who wants to achieve mastery in most registers of the Polish language will find it very instructive to read Herbert, Miłosz, Mickewicz and even Leśmian. They will find articulate sentences and correct phraseology in some poems and get a feel of Polish word-formation in others. As I said, this is not necessary, but it won't harm your improvement. You won't use many of these expressions. But you will have learned something about the language. Note that good poetry is good for a reason. It is good because it sounded right to many native speakers. You can't go wrong with that. Be reasonable, don't try to show off your newly obtained knowledge and you'll be well off. I tried it with English and I consider myself well off.

    As for good pop song lyrics, well, I agree that this exists. The problem is how one can recognize it. The general rule seems to be, "If it sounds good to a native ear, it's good for you in this or another way." The learner may not have a native ear at hand, unfortunately. I'm sure you actually agree that strong skepticism is strongly recommended.

    What I'm saying is based on my own learning experience and experiences from various langugage forums. I see learners trying to make sense of pieces of lousy lyrics in English all the time. They write tens of posts and all they get is irritation of answerers and tiredness for themselves.
    You've got too much prejudices about song lyrics, don't you? "To nie ja" has very beautiful, reivindicative and daring lyrics, as well as literary quality.
     

    CarlitosMS

    Senior Member
    Spanish - Spain
    By the way, I don't understand what does the verb "dodawać" mean in this case, since "add" doesn't sound natural to me at all.

    Kind regards and sorry for any inconvenience
    Carlos M.S.
     

    jasio

    Senior Member
    By the way, I don't understand what does the verb "dodawać" mean in this case, since "add" doesn't sound natural to me at all.
    "Dodawać" is a pretty universal word often used in situations when you have something and you receive something more, or sometimes you have nothing and you get some. It's not always translated to "add". dodawać - tłumaczenie słowa – słownik polsko-angielski Ling.pl includes translations like "add", "append", "link", "lend" (or in Spanish: añadir, agregar, sumar) - of course in specific contexts.

    Consequently, I'd translate the phrase to "don't blame me more than I am really guilty".

    EDIT: or perhaps: "don't blame me more than I truly deserve"
     
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    Kotek

    New Member
    Polish
    Why would anybody want to learn a language from song lyrics? It's a bad idea. Read novels, poetry. But pop songs? They are written to make money, not to make sense. Songwriters will use expressions no one else uses and no one appreciates. They can do it because no one cares.
    It's not always so bad. But it happens, that grammar structure is missing in favour of rhymes :)
     
    Last edited:

    Kotek

    New Member
    Polish
    Thank you very much for your kind answer.

    I tried to find "dodawać win" in dictionaries and found nothing. Is it normal?
    It's not so easy. "Dodawać win" may be understood as "add wine" in Plural form.
    You shouldn't mix 2 different (kinds of) wine: Nie powinieneś mieszać dwóch różnych win
    Dodawać win is not a common collocation so you can't find it
    This may be helpful https://synonim.net/synonim/wina
     

    CarlitosMS

    Senior Member
    Spanish - Spain
    It's not always so bad. But it happens, that grammar structure is missing for the favour of rhymes :)
    Hello, "Dodawać" means "add" in this case or it has a figurative meaning that doesn't appear in dictionaries? I just can't seem to understand it.
     

    Kotek

    New Member
    Polish
    Hello

    I would like to know what this sentence means, since literally, "don't add me faults/guilts" doesn't sound natural.

    Greetings
    It's a bit surprising me when you give a sentence in English which is a translation of a Polish sentence and you sum up "doesn't sound natural.
    Which language you mean?
    Hello, "Dodawać" means "add" in this case or it has a figurative meaning that doesn't appear in dictionaries? I just can't seem to understand it.
    In this context dodawać is more like blame sb for sth because the sentence is dodawać win

    don't lay more blame for anything on me

    don't put more blame on me
    don't blame me more

    I wrote above, but is still not approved probably because of the link to a dictionary so:
    Dodawać win may be understood as add wine in Plural.
    E.g.: You shouldn't mix 2 different (kinds of) wine: Nie powinieneś mieszać dwóch różnych win


     
    Last edited:

    yezyk

    Member
    Polish
    I would say these song lyrics are quite poetic, actually.
    And "nie dodawaj mi win" could be said in real life, by someone this dramatic and poetic : D
     
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