out of morning vs. of a morning

stenka25

Senior Member
South Korea, Han-gul
Let me ask you one expression.


In the underlined part of the below sentence,



"I reached to get a fresh necktie [out of morning]"
"I reached out to get a fresh necktie [of a morning]"


Which one of the above analysis is better?
And can you tell me the meaning of the "out of morning" or "of a morning"?


And, if you can, can you show me another example sentence?


Whatever of these two expressions is possible, it's very new to me-I mean I haven't seen anything like this before.


I still remember that I had a bunch of neckties hanging on the walls; and when I reached out of a morning to get a fresh necktie, the cockroaches scattered in all directions.
 
  • Copyright

    Senior Member
    American English
    I'm afraid "out of a morning" and "of a morning" don't mean anything to me. I think you may mean "one morning," but, if not, perhaps you can tell us in other words what you would like to say:

    I still remember that I had a bunch of neckties hanging on the walls, and when I reached out one morning to get a fresh necktie, the cockroaches scattered in all directions.
     

    Tatzingo

    Senior Member
    English, UK
    Let me ask you one expression.


    In the underlined part of the below sentence,



    "I reached to get a fresh necktie [out of morning]"
    "I reached out to get a fresh necktie [of a morning]"


    Which one of the above analysis is better?
    And can you tell me the meaning of the "out of morning" or "of a morning"?


    And, if you can, can you show me another example sentence?


    Whatever of these two expressions is possible, it's very new to me-I mean I haven't seen anything like this before.


    I still remember that I had a bunch of neckties hanging on the walls; and when I reached out of a morning to get a fresh necktie, the cockroaches scattered in all directions.
    I have to agree with Copyright.

    Both your examples make no sense.

    Which does your text come from? Is the word "morning" used elsewhere in the text? Could it be a brand name for some antiquated piece of furniture?

    Tatz.
     

    Cagey

    post mod (English Only / Latin)
    English - US
    This should be broken down into the phrasal verb reached out, and the prepositional phrase of a morning.
    and when I reached out
    of a morning

    to get a fresh necktie
    ...
    I recognize of a morning, though the construction is not so common these days. Dictionary.com describes the "adverbial time phrase" this way:
    Our Living Language : Some speakers of vernacular English varieties, particularly in isolated or mountainous regions of the southern United States, use phrases such as of a night or of an evening in place of Standard English at night or in the evening, as in We'd go hunting of an evening. This of construction is used only when referring to a repeated action—where Standard English uses nights, evenings, and the like, as in We'd go hunting nights. It is not used for single actions, as in She returned at night. [....]
    That is, your sentence tells us that, morning after morning, when the narrator reached out for a tie, the cockroaches scattered.

    The note under "Our Living Language" says more about the history and use of the construction. I find it interesting.
     

    Copyright

    Senior Member
    American English
    It's been so long since I've heard "of a morning/of an evening" that I'd nearly forgotten it -- and certainly did in this thread. Thank you for the reminder, Cagey.

    I do think that I would use "would" rather than the simple past tense in these constructions, though:

    ...and when I would reach out of a morning to get a fresh necktie, the cockroaches would scatter in all directions.

    The other problem with this sentence for the reader is that "reach out of" is an expression by itself, which adds to the confusion: A hand reached out of the darkness and grasped him firmly around the neck. :eek:
     

    Cagey

    post mod (English Only / Latin)
    English - US
    It's true that the examples Dictionary.com use contracted forms of would:
    We'd go hunting of an evening. [=We would ....]
    It is probably the more common construction. I'm not certain whether it's necessary.
    Summers, we sat outside of an evening and talked about everything.
    That sounds all right, I think. In that sentence, I don't think we need "would" to tell us that it was habitual. In the topic sentence, it seems to me that when [=whenever] along with the other cues may generalize sufficiently to make "of a morning" acceptable.
     
    Last edited:

    Copyright

    Senior Member
    American English
    Good example with "sat outside of an evening" but we sometimes just say "sat out" (rather than "sat in") and that's where the reader stumbles for a moment: We sat out of an evening...

    I'm not trying to be contrary; just suggesting that the "out of" construction takes you down a well-worn path before you realize you need to double-back and have another look at that fork in the road and take the one less traveled. :)
     

    buzhidao

    Member
    Amercan English
    I believe, after some quick googling, that it should say this: "I still remember that I had a bunch of neckties hanging on the walls, and when I reached out every morning to get a fresh necktie, the cockroaches scattered in all directions."

    The book I found this in is called " The Leader in You" By Dale Carnegie, Stuart R. Levine.
     

    Cagey

    post mod (English Only / Latin)
    English - US
    I'm not trying to be contrary; just suggesting that the "out of" construction takes you down a well-worn path before you realize you need to double-back and have another look at that fork in the road and take the one less traveled. :)
    Oh, sorry.

    I should have acknowledged your point about the conjunction of prepositions in the original sentence. Yes, you are right. It is not surprising that it gave stenka trouble. It would tend to trip up readers.
     

    Cagey

    post mod (English Only / Latin)
    English - US
    I believe, after some quick googling, that it should say this: "I still remember that I had a bunch of neckties hanging on the walls, and when I reached out every morning to get a fresh necktie, the cockroaches scattered in all directions."

    The book I found this in is called " The Leader in You" By Dale Carnegie, Stuart R. Levine.
    I'm not certain this version is the original. I found your version on the web, with a publication date of 1995.

    I also found this earlier version, which has the "of a morning" construction, and Dale Carnegie as the sole author.
    How To Stop Worrying and Start Dale Carnegie - (1948)
    I still remember that I had a bunch of neckties hanging on the walls; and when I reached out of a morning to get a fresh necktie, the cockroaches...
     

    stenka25

    Senior Member
    South Korea, Han-gul
    Thanks, Cagey.
    Thanks, Copyright.
    Your ping-pong threads give me a good study.

    [Am I using 'ping-pong' in the right context?^^;]

    Thank you all who engaged in my question.
     
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