Persian: برخوردار - one who benefits/gains

PersoLatin

Senior Member
UK
Persian - Iran
Is برخوردار deconstructed as برخورد-ار (according to Dehkhoda) or برخور-دار?

I believe برخور-دار is the answer and here's my reasons:

برخوردن means:
1) to benefit, to gain:
سپاسم ز یزدان که دادم خرد
روانم همی از خرد برخورد

I thank the Lord who gave me wisdom
from which my soul always benefits,

2) to come together:به ‏او ‏برخوردم ‏/I came across her (also برخورد کردن/to clash)
2.1) to be offended: ‏به ‏من ‏برخورد‏/I was offended

Dehkhoda states that برخورد-ار has the same structure as رفتار ‏کردار ‏دیدار/visiting/seeing, deeds/actions, behaviour respectively, based on this برخوردار at best can mean: the coming together, a clash, and not 'the one who benefits'.

In my view, برخور-دار is a compound and literally means 'the possessor of benefit', basically the same as برخور.
 
  • Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    Sulayman Hayyim's dictionary nicely lists the various meanings of بر on pages 240-241. The meaning, in my view, that is most relevant is that of "fruit", given under heading 4, an example of which is.

    هرگز ازشاخ بید بر نخوری "You will never find fruit on the willow."

    Therefore بر خوردن based on this meaning implies "To eat fruit" and by extension, "To reap benefit"

    I would tend to agree with Dehkhoda's explanation for the word بر خورد + آر in the same way we get nouns in the manner of دیدن > دید > دیدار, رفتن > رفتار, گفتن > گفتار

    By this logic, برخوردار to my mind implies one who is a beneficiary or بهره مند .

    سپاسم ز یزدان که دارم خرد
    روانم همی از خرد برخورد

    sipaas-am zi yazdaan kih daaram xirad
    ravaan-am hame az xirazd bar-xvar-ad

    I am grateful to God that I have (been given) wisdom
    (For) it is this very wisdom that is benefiting my soul
     
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    PersoLatin

    Senior Member
    UK
    Persian - Iran
    سپاسم ز یزدان که دارم خرد
    روانم همی از خرد برخورد
    دارم or دادم, sad state of affairs as so many of our good works have different versions, I won't attempt arguing which is correct.
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    دارم or دادم, sad state of affairs as so many of our good works have different versions, I won't attempt arguing which is correct.
    I copied from گنجور although دادم for me is a better choice, where دادم of course means مرا داد. The choice of one or the other should not affect the line of thought I am taking.
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I don't know if you used آر instead of ار on purpose to suggest it derives from آوردن ‏ ?? Maybe not but can you please clarify.
    No I used آر without giving it much thought. I am saying it is "bar-xurd + aar. This is the same as saying برخورد + ار .
     

    PersoLatin

    Senior Member
    UK
    Persian - Iran
    I am saying it is "bar-xurd + aar. This is the same as saying برخورد + ار .
    Ok thanks, so back to where we were.

    رفتار ‏کردار ‏دیدار/visiting/seeing, deeds/actions, behaviour respectively, based on this برخوردار at best can mean: the coming together, a clash, and not 'the one who benefits'.
    You obviously don't agree that برخوردار has to have a meaning consistent with its verbal structure, like the others mentioned. Anyway that is the understood view of the structure (برخورد + ار) which I have also found for myself.
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    My understanding may be faulty. However, as far as I can see, bar-xurd-aar is being formed in exactly the same way as guft-aar, diid-aar, raft-aar, xvaast-aar and the rest.

    If you want it to give it the meaning of "coming together/clash", then the "bar" in question means "breast/chest" or "side". So, one's breast/side hitting another person would be bar-xurdan, in the same way as zamiin-xurdan (to hit the ground/to fall to the ground). Having said this, in bar-xurd-aar (and NOT bar xur-daar), the base meaning of "bar" is fruit. This is how I am understanding all this. Let's leave this to our learned friends in the forum.
     

    PersoLatin

    Senior Member
    UK
    Persian - Iran
    the base meaning of "bar" is fruit.
    As you say, bar/بر has many meanings incl: up/high, side, outcome/result (secondary meaning fruit), etc. In almost all cases where bar/بر is used with a verb, as a pre-verb, it means: up/raise/high, however in برخوردن with 'benefit' as the meaning, it points to outcome/result.

    The meaning of برخوردار as a word is not the question here, but does the 'accepted' structure yield the 'accepted' meaning? Maybe easier to look at the meaning of خوردار when compared to رفتار ‏کردار ‏دیدار
     
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