Pronunciation: with someone / south side

tomonori

tomonori

Member
Japan
Japanese
When you say "with someone" frequently,
how do you pronounce it ?

Does it need "th" sound?


I was listening to Numb by Linkin Park,
and this is the lyrics.

But I know you were just like me
With someone disappointed in you


It sounds like "wids someone"


And the other question is,
How do you pronounce this below.
"South Side"
Does it need "th" sound or it is not necessary ?

I think there is a name or a title if some sounds are taken out....
 
    • It does need the "th" sound, but a lot of people omit it anyway. You will be understood if you choose not to say it, but I strongly recommend substituting it for another sound, like "d", or "z". Mostly it's a case of people saying it too fast or too casually that they don't notice the "th" sound disappearing.

    "South Side" you most definitely need to pronounce the "th". If omitted it sounds silly.
     
    Speaking English is a lot different than singing it. Singers take all kinds of creative license when singing their lines. Often it is because they are singing fast, as fish said, and other times it might be to get a different sound out of a word.

    I would advise you don't use rock and roll, or any other musical band as a reference for how to speak certain words.
     
    Note that the th in south and with are different sounds (for most speakers). Th in with is usually voiced, which means it is more likely to be pronounced like a d by some speakers. The unvoiced th of south, is less likely to.

    With is also heard pronounced like wit or, when followed by you (for example), as wich ("with you": wi'choo). In some speech styles th in with may disappear completely (wi') or become a glottal stop.

    These speech styles vary from what might be considered "standard" pronunciation. It would be unwise, I think, for a learner of English to consciously adopt such a style, although, with sufficient exposure one might pick it up naturally over time.
     
    Matching Mole said:
    Note that the th in south and with are different sounds (for most speakers). Th in with is usually voiced, which means it is more likely to be pronounced like a d by some speakers. The unvoiced th of south, is less likely to.
    Click to expand...
    The th in South does have at least one dialectal variant, I think.
    I reckon you may sometimes hear "Souf side" in some areas in or around London. Or am I mistaken?
     
    LV4-26 said:
    I reckon you may sometimes hear "Souf side" in some areas in or around London. Or am I mistaken?
    Click to expand...
    No, you're absolutely right, LV:) (It's not just there but it's a particular characteristic of there.)
    I come from a part of England where with is routinely pronounced wi' ~ like a shortened version of wee.
     
    LV4-26 said:
    The th in South does have at least one dialectal variant, I think.
    I reckon you may sometimes hear "Souf side" in some areas in or around London. Or am I mistaken?
    Click to expand...
    No, you are not mistaken, it's very common in those areas (the whole word sounding like saaf, and north like nawf). I meant that th in south is less likely to sound like a d (unlike in with), although it may, I think, be pronounced something like a t in some speech styles.
     
    Huh,
    it is one big argument-able question....
    Although I do not agree that we cannot use songs as references....

    Anyway,
    I have one more big question.

    How do you pronounce "south side" ?
    I mean, when I pronounce it, it sounds like, "south thide" or "with thomeone"....
    Does anyone know what I mean ?
    Or, is that only my problem?
     
    That is a problem that a lot of East Asians have with this sound. I don't know any East Asians so I don't know the best way to fix it, but I guess you can just keep practising and it will come eventually.
     
    tomonori said:
    How do you pronounce "south side" ?
    I mean, when I pronounce it, it sounds like, "south thide" or "with thomeone"....
    Does anyone know what I mean ?
    Or, is that only my problem?
    Click to expand...
    Usually someone who has difficulty with the letter S in those words has some kind of lisp.

    LISP: The habit or an act of lisping; To pronounce the sibilant letter ‘s’ imperfectly; to give ‘s’ and ‘z’ the sounds of ‘th’ (IPA: /θ / ð/) — a defect common amongst children; To speak with imperfect articulation; to mispronounce, as a child learning to talk; To speak hesitatingly and with a low ...
    en.wiktionary.org/wiki/lisp
     
    Valvs said:
    That's my suggestion as well. Many of my compatriots have the same problem when they start learning English, but it is easily solved by practicing.
    Click to expand...
    Sometimes I'm not sure if practising is always the answer though. I've been trying to get my Slavic "R"'s correct for months, but seemingly no progress.
     
    ><FISH'> said:
    Sometimes I'm not sure if practising is always the answer though. I've been trying to get my Slavic "R"'s correct for months, but seemingly no progress.
    Click to expand...
    If you watch "My Fair lady" you'll see that practicing can indeed change a person's native dialect.

    Sorry if that's OT. :)
     
    Maybe this is my problem but I need to ask one more.

    I can pronounce "th" and "s" or any kinds of sounds that we do not have in Japanese.
    But what I mean was,
    If you say it like really faster ,
    how is it going to be?

    Like, saying it in one second, or 0.5 second or something.

    NOT like this below.
    South........Side


    Like this below.
    Southside.
    or
    South
    side
     
    Here in the Chicago area, when we refer to the South Side (which we do frequently, because Chicago is the "City of Neighborhoods"), we pronounce the phrase like a two-syllable word, thus: "southside". The tip of the tonque pokes out for just an instant on the "th" and then goes right back to the roof of the mouth for the "s".
     
    My computer balks at Adobe Flash Player, so I cannot hear your pronunciation.

    Except for people who cannot pronounce s at all, I know of no native English speaker who pronounces s as th after a th. And th never sounds like an s except after an s (e.g. in a variant pronunciation of isthmus). This is true at any speaking speed or rhythm.

    Note that when a word ends in s (or sh or ch, etc.), the plural form has another syllable, but this is not true of any word ending in th because, unlike these other sounds, the th sound, to native English speakers, is nothing like an s sound.
     
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