Punjabi: tree

panjabigator

Senior Member
Am. English
Greetings and Eid Mubārak to my (formerly) fasting friends.

I'd like to ask a bit about the word "tree" in Punjabi. At my house, we typically say "darakht," which my father pronounces more like "drakhat." In Punjab, I heard "rukkh" and "peR," but more the latter than the former. And then I've also encountered "brichh" in written Punjabi, which must be related to the Hindi/Sanskrit वृक्ष.

What words do you hear in your idiolect? Any other words for trees or shrubs that you think might be worth mention?

As always, I appreciate your commentary.
Panjabigator
 
  • hindiurdu

    Senior Member
    Hindi-Urdu, Punjabi, Kashmiri
    A bit off track but, wow!, I was just looking into daraxt >> draxat. This is apparently metathesis. From wikipedia:

    Both ancient and modern Dardic languages demonstrate a marked tendency towards metathesis where a "pre- or postconsonantal 'r' is shifted forward to a preceding syllable".[5][13] This was seen in Ashokan rock edicts (erected 269 BCE to 231 BCE) in the Gandhara region, where Dardic dialects were and still are widespread. Examples include a tendency to misspell the Sanskrit words priyadarshi (one of the titles of Emperor Ashoka) as priyadrashi and dharma as dhrama.[13] Modern-day Kalasha uses the word driga (Sanskrit: dirgha, meaning long).[13] Palula uses drubalu (Sanskrit: durbala, weak) and brhuj (Sanskrit: bhurja, birch tree).[13] Kashmiri uses drolid2 (Sanskrit: daridra, impoverished) and krama (Sanskrit: karma, work or action).[13] Western Pahari languages (such as Dogri), Sindhi and Lahnda (Western Punjabi) also share this Dardic tendency to metathesis though they are considered non-Dardic, for example in the Punjabi word drakhat (from Persian: darakht, tree).


    So your dad is doing something that people in our region have been doing in a documented way for 2500 years at least! That's pretty amazing. Also, in my experience almost everyone pronounces the x in draxat as exactly that, i.e. don't make the x >> kh deterioration. I wonder why. What about the word "booTa"? Kashmiri has the word "kul" - anyone ever hear this in any regional Punjabi variant?
     

    panjabigator

    Senior Member
    Am. English
    I'm sure my father will be pleased to know that he speaks a language with historical continuity!
    Also, in my experience almost everyone pronounces the x in draxat as exactly that, i.e. don't make the x >> kh deterioration

    In Indian Punjab, septuagenarians aside I very rarely heard anyone pronounce the voiceless fricative velar (خ).

    Isn't "būṭā" more for shrubs? Never heard the Kashmiri word. Thanks for sharing it.
     
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    marrish

    Senior Member
    اُردو Urdu
    Thank you for the greetings.
    I'm not aware of any other word for a tree. Our QP SaaHib can perhaps come up with something else. buuTaa is a plant rather. It can be used for a sapling of a tree.
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I'm sure my father will be pleased to know that he speaks a language with historical continuity!


    In Indian Punjab, septuagenarians aside I very rarely heard anyone pronounce the voiced fricative velar (خ).

    Isn't "būṭā" more for shrubs? Never heard the Kashmiri word. Thanks for sharing it.

    I would go along with hindiurdu SaaHib that "buuTaa" is indeed used for a tree as well as a plant/shrub. In addition, "buuTaa" is a proper name as in Muhammad BuuTaa (name of a Punjabi poet) and BuuTaa Singh. I know a solicitor whose name is BuuTaa Singh.

    On my father side of the family, daraxt/draxt is the common word for a tree but my mother's side it is "rukkh" all the time.
     
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    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I'm sure my father will be pleased to know that he speaks a language with historical continuity!


    In Indian Punjab, septuagenarians aside I very rarely heard anyone pronounce the voiced fricative velar (خ).

    Isn't "būṭā" more for shrubs? Never heard the Kashmiri word. Thanks for sharing it.

    Did you mean voiceless fricative? The voiced one would be Ghain غ.
     

    marrish

    Senior Member
    اُردو Urdu
    (...) In Punjab, I heard "rukkh" and "peR," but more the latter than the former. And then I've also encountered "brichh" in written Punjabi, which must be related to the Hindi/Sanskrit वृक्ष. (...)

    Thinking about this I was wondering whether rukkh is related to Sanskrit वृक्ष as well. On hindsight I have serious doubts about it. There must be other words for 'tree' in Sanskrit that have similar form to वृक्ष, otherwise the vowel ''r'' must have been pronounced as ''ru'' in early Prakrit and the initial 'v' dissappeared to make things simple.
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    Thinking about this I was wondering whether rukkh is related to Sanskrit वृक्ष as well. On hindsight I have serious doubts about it. There must be other words for 'tree' in Sanskrit that have similar form to वृक्ष, otherwise the vowel ''r'' must have been pronounced as ''ru'' in early Prakrit and the initial 'v' dissappeared to make things simple.

    I have a feeling that "rukkh" is linked to vrksh. I'll try to think of an example where part of a consonant cluster has fallen off! (OK,vr is not technically a consonant cluster, but it is for us simple people!)
     
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    panjabigator

    Senior Member
    Am. English
    Thinking about this I was wondering whether rukkh is related to Sanskrit वृक्ष as well. On hindsight I have serious doubts about it. There must be other words for 'tree' in Sanskrit that have similar form to वृक्ष, otherwise the vowel ''r'' must have been pronounced as ''ru'' in early Prakrit and the initial 'v' dissappeared to make things simple.

    Wow, this blew my mind. I didn't even consider वृक्ष and rukkh before. It's got to be related. Has anyone heard "brichh?"
     

    marrish

    Senior Member
    اُردو Urdu
    Probably it is correct to say so since this is very common scenario however it might be worth mention that it would be restricted to Punjabi then. My Hindi dictionary contains many older or rustic words but I couldn't find a trace of brichh. Finding the word in Punjabi literature could lead us to some answers as to the usage.
     
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