Russian: dialectal pronunciation of ending "-ов"

AndrasBP

Senior Member
Hungarian
Hello,

On YouTube, there's a native Russian speaker from Odessa who pronounces words like "готов" or "столов" with a diphthong /ou/, instead of the standard /of/.
He says "я готоу" and "много столоу".
It's a bit like the Slovak or Belarusian pronunciation of "-ov", but I've never heard this from Russian speakers before.

Do you know if it's a regional thing common in Odessa, or perhaps a direct idiosyncratic influence of Ukrainian, where the equivalent of the Russian genitive ending "-ов" is "-iв", pronounced /iw/?
 
  • rushalaim

    Senior Member
    русский
    That is dialect of countrymen. Hard v-sound appeared in Russian just from Greek with Christianity.
     

    rushalaim

    Senior Member
    русский
    Right! Russians (in Ukraine, Belorussia, Russia) of country are still pronouncing -ow instead of -ov. That is old pronunciation despite late city educated form -ov (made by Greek Christianity). You can find that form in town-names on old Slavic lands: Moscow, Pilau, Warsaw (and of many towns in Eastern part of Germany).
     

    Awwal12

    Senior Member
    Russian
    ʋʋ
    Hello,

    On YouTube, there's a native Russian speaker from Odessa who pronounces words like "готов" or "столов" with a diphthong /ou/, instead of the standard /of/.
    He says "я готоу" and "много столоу".
    It's a bit like the Slovak or Belarusian pronunciation of "-ov", but I've never heard this from Russian speakers before.

    Do you know if it's a regional thing common in Odessa, or perhaps a direct idiosyncratic influence of Ukrainian, where the equivalent of the Russian genitive ending "-ов" is "-iв", pronounced /iw/?
    That is typical in the Russian language of Ukraine, where it definitely comes from the Ukrainian substrate. Ukrainian simply doesn't devoice its /в/ in any position, so assuming the morphological analogy is hardly necessary.

    Also it is a dialectal feature in many proper Russian dialects (especially South Russian), but that is not much relevant in our case

    It also should be noted that keeping the voiced [v]~[ʋ] in the positions where /v/ is normally devoiced is a variation of orthoepic norm in Russian (I wince every time they declare "следующая остано[ʋ]ка" in Moscow buses). [w]~[u̯], on the other hand, is considered orthoepically abnormal (despite it being much more widespread dialectally).
    That is old pronunciation despite late city educated form -ov (made by Greek Christianity).
    It seems you are spreading this misconception again.
    [v] originated from the proto-Slavic [ʋ] in the Rostov-Suzdal dialects of Old Russian without any relation to Christianity. All East Slavic lands were Christianized, but [v] originally appeared only there; assuming any influence of Greek would be superfluous even if it weren't typologically (and logically) unlikely by itself. Appearance of proper [v] automatically allowed the formation of [f] through the devoicing as soon as the yers fell, since all fricatives were equally susceptible. In other East Slavic dialects [f] didn't consistently appear until much later (sometimes well into the age of mass education), and there was even less reason to change anything about local realizations of /в/ (Ukrainian and Belorussian didn't at all).

    In Russian [v] became the main realization only because it existed in the Old Moscow dialect from the start, which inherited it from the Rostov-Suzdal dialects of Old Russian (Old Moscow dialect demonstrates a combination of North Russian and South Russian features; North Russian, in turn, developed from the Rostov-Suzdal dialects of Old Russian with some Old Novgorodian influence around the XV-XVI centuries).
     
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    Awwal12

    Senior Member
    Russian
    Brezhnev spoke with a pretty thick Ukrainian accent. I actually suppose that Soviet leaders carefully nurtured their local accents to give themselves an image of particular proximity to the working class. That's merely a guess, of course. Anyway, even in modern Ukrainian cities it's more subtle; at least they usually replace the fricative [ɦ] with the appropriate plosive [g] (which is present in standard Ukrainian anyway).
     

    ahvalj

    Senior Member
    Brezhnev spoke with a pretty thick Ukrainian accent. I actually suppose that Soviet leaders carefully nurtured their local accents to give themselves an image of particular proximity to the working class. That's merely a guess, of course. Anyway, even in modern Ukrainian cities it's more subtle; at least they usually replace the fricative [ɦ] with the appropriate plosive [g] (which is present in standard Ukrainian anyway).
    I've found a living person (a Ukrainian intellectual) on Youtube (search "Владислав Оленченко Ukrlife") speaking very much as Brezhnev did and even with a similar timbre.

    A Russian counterpart of this accent is found in Gorbachev: he is half-Ukrainian, but the way he speaks («на ўсех ураўнях») is typical of the older generation in the countryside in the south. They lack the characteristic Ukrainian nasality there though.
     

    rushalaim

    Senior Member
    русский
    I've found a living person (a Ukrainian intellectual) on Youtube (search "Владислав Оленченко Ukrlife") speaking very much as Brezhnev did and even with a similar timbre.

    A Russian counterpart of this accent is found in Gorbachev: he is half-Ukrainian, but the way he speaks («на ўсех ураўнях») is typical of the older generation in the countryside in the south. They lack the characteristic Ukrainian nasality there though.
    («на ўсех ураўнях») - That's very funny! I even imagined Gorbi's pronunciation. Thank you for a minute of joy! ))
     
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