Swedish: psykologisk pedagogik

risingmoon

Senior Member
Mexican spanish
Good day. This thread derives from another previous one: Dr. phil. in psychologischer Pädagogik, Dr. med. sci. in Psychiatrie. I'm translating some data about Dr. Heinz Leymann into Spanish, taken from his website "The Mobbing Encyclopaedia" (Wayback Machine). The words "psykologisk pedagogik" appears in the following paragraph:

Professor Leymann föddes den 320717 i Tyskland, men är svensk medborgare sedan mitten av 1950-talet. Han är fil. dr. i psykologisk pedagogik (dvs inlärningspsykologi) samt med. dr. i psykiatri, vilket dock är en ren forskningsdoktor. Han är inte läkare, utan arbetar som kliniker utifrån sin legitimation som psykolog.

My attempt:

El profesor Leymann nació en Alemania el 17 de julio de 1932, pero es ciudadano sueco desde mediados de la década de 1950. Él es Dr. en Pedagogía Psicológica (es decir, Psicología del Aprendizaje), así como Dr. en Psiquiatría, que es, sin embargo, un doctorado de investigación pura. Él no es médico, pero trabaja como médico basado en sus credenciales como psicólogo.

Is the translation of the first doctorate correct? If so, is it true that this is what the Psychology of Learning/Learning Psychology was called in Sweden? Because it turns out that "psychological pedagogy" is a sort of branch of Pedagogy (Tipos de Pedagogía: educando desde diferentes especialidades), which is confusing.

Thank you from this moment for the support!
 
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  • risingmoon

    Senior Member
    Mexican spanish
    Happy 2019 everyone! I apology for my delay.

    Thank you very much for your proposal, Obolensky. If you don't mind, I would like to know why you consider it to be "Psicología Educativa".
     

    Obolensky

    Senior Member
    swedish - Sweden
    Because the significant meaning of the phrase ”Pedagogía Psicológica” seems to be Educational psychology - Wikipedia and in my reading that is ”inlärningspsykologi” (inlärning/learning/aprendizaje + psykologi/psychology/psicologogia)

    And your mainword/noun is PSYKOLOGI (in swedish) and PEDAGOGISK is your adjective (in swedish), so in my point of reading the phrase should go PEDAGOGISK PSYKOLOGI.
     

    raumar

    Senior Member
    Norwegian
    The basic problem here seems to be that the original text is self-contradictory:
    Han är fil. dr. i psykologisk pedagogik (dvs inlärningspsykologi)
    "Psykologisk pedagogik" would be a psychology-oriented branch of pedagogy, as risingmoon writes in post #1, while "inlärningspsykologi" is a learning-oriented branch of psychology. That's not the same.

    If we can trust Wikipedia, Leymann had a PhD in pedagogical psychology and another PhD in psychiatry, and he was a professor of psychology. Nothing indicates that he had any degree or university position within the dicipline of pedagogy. Spanish Wikipedia uses "psicología pedagógica".

    Heinz Leymann – Wikipedia
    Heinz Leymann - Wikipedia, la enciclopedia libre

    So I wonder if some of the information in the original text may be wrong. Maybe somebody accidentally wrote "psykologisk pedagogik" instead of "pedagogisk psykologi"?
     

    risingmoon

    Senior Member
    Mexican spanish
    Thanks, raumar and Obolensky for your time and contributions. "The Mobbing Encyclopaedia" was the official website created by Heinz Leymann. The website contents stop running several years ago and then -I don't know exactly when, but I noticed it in 2018- was rescued by Wayback Machine. The contents are available in three languages (The Mobbing Encyclopaedia): German, English, and Swedish. As far as I know, he mastered German and Swedish, but not English, for which he used to receive help. If we compare that contents, we can see that they aren't exactly the same, there are some differences in various points. Please see, in the three languages, the section "Presentation of Professor Heinz Leymann". In each one we can read the following:

    GERMAN- Er ist Dr. fhil. in psychologischer Pädagogik (so nennt man in Schweden Wissenschaftler der Lernpsychologie, die sich auch mit praxisbetonten Methoden befaßt haben). Er ist Dr. med. Sci (Doctor of medical science) in Psychiatrie.
    ENGLISH - He holds a doctor´s degree in Pedagogical Psychology (as the science of learning psychology is called in Sweden when the scholar also studies learning procedures). He has an MD sci (doctor of medical science) in Psychiatry (...).
    SWEDISH - Han är fil. dr. i psykologisk pedagogik (dvs inlärningspsykologi) samt med. dr. i psykiatri (...).

    Something else. This link could be helpful?: https://www.edu.su.se/polopoly_fs/1.25961.1334906850!/menu/standard/file/Doktorsavhandlingar_ped_arkivlista.pdf (please see the title, and the number 26, page 2).

    Thanks again.
     
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    raumar

    Senior Member
    Norwegian
    I see - the fact that he took his PhD at the pedagogy department is also relevant here (or maybe pedagogy is called 'educational science' in a university context). Anyway, I think we can assume that Leymann's work lies at the borderline between these two disciplines (or three, if we include psychiatry). Maybe the distinction isn't very sharp, or it might have been less sharp in the 1970s when Leymann took his PhD. If you look at the list of PhDs from Pedagogiska institutionen, you will see that the topic of many of them are close to psychology.

    If we compare the three versions of the text, and focus on the German and the Swedish versions (since he mastered these language), the German is more detailed. It says that "psychological pedagogy" is what the psychology of learning is called in Swedish.

    If this is just a peculiar Swedish label for this field of research, and if Leymann needed to explain what it meant when he wrote in German, I suppose it doesn't make sense in Spanish either. So my advice would be to use the German text as the starting point for your translation, since the Swedish version seems to use concepts that must be explained for non-Swedes.
     

    risingmoon

    Senior Member
    Mexican spanish
    Thank you for your analysis, your suggestions, and your time raumar. I think I understand your reasoning.

    Being totally honest, I do not know if Leymann himself wrote the contents in German and Swedish. I suppose so, but if another person wrote them, Leymann must have authorized them.

    The German and Swedish versions are consistent ("psychological pedagogy" / literal translation into Spanish, and existent type of Pedagogy: “pedagogía psicológica”), and the English version is just the opposite (pedagogical psychology), but I do not understand why. Because of this contradiction, I suppose the English version could be discarded.

    I think it is more important the fact that in parentheses is clarified that the correct name - and in this, the three languages coincide - is "Lernpsychologie / learning psychology / inlärningspsykologi", do you agree? If I choose this solution, the other problem is how to translate "Lernpsychologie" into Spanish: psicología educativa [educational psychology] or psicología del aprendizaje [learning psychology]? They are not the same. Besides, I ignore the curriculum content of the doctorate at the time.

    Possible solution. According to Großer Lernwortschatz - Spanisch aktuell (by Pedro Álvarez Olañeta & Trinidad Bonachera Álvarez), page 179, “Lernpsychologie” is “psicología del aprendizaje” [learning psychology] and “pädagogische Psychologie” is “psicología educativa” [educational psychology] (please see it in Google books, the link don´t work). So I think the first one is the right one.

    What do you think? Thanks in advance.
     
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    raumar

    Senior Member
    Norwegian
    Well, I am no expert on psychology or educational sciences, and I don't know much about the subfields within psychology. But the title of Leymann's dissertation is "Kan arbetslivet demokratiseras? Om vikten av att se demokratisering som en inlärningsprocess". So the topic is learning, rather than the education that takes place in the school system.

    On the other hand, according to Wikipedia, "Educational psychology is the branch of psychology concerned with the scientific study of human learning." It is apparently not limited to learning in schools. In other word, the difference between learning psychology and educational psychology doesn't seem clear-cut to me.

    Educational psychology - Wikipedia
     

    risingmoon

    Senior Member
    Mexican spanish
    Thank you very much for your time and effort raumar. I agree with you regarding that the subject is learning (in this case, in the context of the workplace and linked to democratization). As far as I know, learning psychology precedes various theoretical and application fields within psychology: clinical, educational, social, etc.; it is a broader branch of psychology than educational psychology. And as I said in #9, "They are not the same. Besides, I ignore the curriculum content of the doctorate at the time." To be honest, at this point I feel in an impasse. I will continue searching and if I find something worthwhile I will share it here. Until then and thanks again.
     
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