Syrian Arabic: لمّا with attached pronouns?

[BreannaD-K]

I feel like somewhere I saw لمّا used with an attached pronoun, but I'm not sure where. Is that able to be done?

For instance, in order to say something like "I always have a very hard time concentrating when I'm sick," would I say, "دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّا أنا تعبانة" or would I drop أنا and/or modify لمّا somehow?

 

[Mahaodeh]

Actually, both are incorrect.

لمّا in this context is used to mean عندما, and as such it should be followed by a verb. I’m assuming that you are using a Levantine dialect here so I would say either لمّا أتعب or لمّا أكون تعبانة.

Having said that, if you are using it as a conditional article, particularly in dialects, it can be followed by a nominal sentence provided that the خبر of the sentence is a verb. Since it’s a nominal sentence, it can start with a pronoun. For example:
لمّا محمد يجي افتحله الباب
لمّا هو يجي افتحله الباب
And in the case of your sentence it can be:
لمّا أنا تعبانة بعرفش اجمّع أفكاري
In this case تعبانة can replace a verb because it’s شبيه بالفعل.

Note that this is in dialects only, in Standard Arabic it must be followed by a verb in both cases.

 

[BreannaD-K]

I think I'm more confused than I was before. My only concern is Syrian Arabic (though Palestinian Arabic is quite close/still helpful). Would you mind clarifying without references to MSA and grammar terms like "conditional article"?

So, for instance, which of the following three sentences would be correct, if any, in Syrian or the broader Levantine dialect?

دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّا أنا تعبانة
دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّا تعبانة
دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّاني تعبانة

(لمّاني is more along the lines of what I think I remember seeing somewhere.)

 

[analeeh]

I don't think I've ever heard لماني.

I think the most likely one is لما بكون تعبانة.

 

[Mahaodeh]

Would you mind clarifying without references to MSA and grammar terms like "conditional article"?

I can avoid referencing MSA, but how can you learn a new language without learning it’s grammar? This means I can only say “wrong” and “right” without explaining it.

I’ll try anyway.

So, for instance, which of the following three sentences would be correct, if any, in Syrian or the broader Levantine dialect?

دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّا أنا تعبانة
دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّا تعبانة
دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّاني تعبانة

They are all wrong, in this context it should always be لمّا بكون تعبانة.

(لمّاني is more along the lines of what I think I remember seeing somewhere.)

No, you can’t say لمّاني in any context. You must have mis-read it, or perhaps you don’t remember accurately.

 

[BreannaD-K]

I can avoid referencing MSA, but how can you learn a new language without learning it’s grammar? This means I can only say “wrong” and “right” without explaining it.

I must have been having a bad day... Not only did I misread your original response as saying both my proposed sentences were correct 😒, I also gave the impression that I don't like grammar! I actually love it! I just don't know what a conditional article is (maybe grammar terms plus an English translation example would have helped my muddled mind?), and my brain was resistant to jumping between MSA and anything else.

Anywho, thank you both for your responses! I think I finally hear you loud and clear!

 

[Kenny-Alpha]

I

I can avoid referencing MSA, but how can you learn a new language without learning it’s grammar? This means I can only say “wrong” and “right” without explaining it.

I’ll try anyway.

They are all wrong, in this context it should always be لمّا بكون تعبانة.


No, you can’t say لمّاني in any context. You must have mis-read it, or perhaps you don’t remember accurately.ieve whete

I think I'm more confused than I was before. My only concern is Syrian Arabic (though Palestinian Arabic is quite close/still helpful). Would you mind clarifying without references to MSA and grammar terms like "conditional article"?

So, for instance, which of the following three sentences would be correct, if any, in Syrian or the broader Levantine dialect?

دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّا أنا تعبانة
دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّا تعبانة
دايماً بتعب كتير لجمّع أفكاري لمّاني تعبانة

(لمّاني is more along the lines of what I think I remember seeing somewhere.)

I follow your logics in that there are few words where suffix pronouns are added to the preposition, as a way to make pronunciation smoother.

For instance, in Syrian and Lebanese Arabic, the following can occur: mitl متل ما becomes mitlmaani متل ماني [as I, like I]. And it goes on: متل مانه، متل ماهن، متل ماكن.

There are a few other words that this can occur in Lebanese and Syrian. I can't remmeber the other ones off the top of my head.