The student scored in the low range in reading; low average range in math (need to repeat verb)

NinaDee

Senior Member
English - United States
Hola a todos/as,

Tenía una consulta acerca de la traducción de la siguiente oración al español:
"The student scored in the low range in reading; low average range in math and average range in written language."

En inglés, no es necesario repetir el verbo; está claro que el mismo verbo se aplica en los tres casos. ¿Funciona igual en español? Es decir, ¿está bien dicha la siguiente oración?
"El alumno obtuvo una puntuación en el rango bajo en la lectura, en el promedio bajo en las matemáticas y en el rango promedio en el lenguaje escrito".

¡Gracias!
 
  • NinaDee

    Senior Member
    English - United States
    Perdón, me di cuenta de que no expresé la pregunta correctamente: no solo el verbo, sino también el sustantivo "puntuación", se omiten en el resto de la oración. Otro ejemplo: "En el examen de literatura, Michael recibió una puntuación de 93; Laura, de 95; y Samuel, de 88". ¿Tienen sentido estas oraciones en español? Gracias. :)
     

    S.V.

    Senior Member
    Español, México
    Yes, it works. Changing it to un - el makes it clearer the first noun describes the second one. Also works without any articles:

    El alumno obtuvo en puntuación un rango bajo en la lectura, un rango medio-bajo en las matemáticas y uno promedio en el lenguaje escrito".
    El alumno obtuvo una puntuación de rango bajo en la lectura, medio-bajo en las matemáticas y promedio en el lenguaje escrito".

    Uno can also replace rango in the other two: un rango bajo... uno medio-bajo y uno promedio. Or repeat rango twice, too.
     

    Lnewqban

    Senior Member
    Spanish - Cuba
    I fully agree with your suggestions (very good!) and with S.V.'s post above.
    Other options:
    El alumno obtuvo las siguientes puntuaciones: rango bajo en la lectura, rango promedio-bajo en las matemáticas y rango promedio en el lenguaje escrito.
    El alumno obtuvo los siguientes rangos de puntuación: bajo en la lectura, promedio-bajo en las matemáticas y promedio en el lenguaje escrito.
     

    jmx

    Senior Member
    Spain / Spanish
    In Spain, with scholar subjects, we usually omit the article:

    ... bajo en lectura, promedio-bajo en matemáticas y promedio en lenguaje escrito.
     

    NinaDee

    Senior Member
    English - United States
    Thank you everyone for your replies! :)

    El alumno obtuvo en puntuación un rango bajo en la lectura, un rango medio-bajo en las matemáticas y uno promedio en el lenguaje escrito".
    S.V., did you mean to write "obtuvo una puntuación" here instead of "obtuvo en puntuación"? And you don't need to say "en un rango bajo"? Also, why does changing "el" to "un" make it clearer that the first noun describes the second one? To me it sounds like you're saying "a score in a low range" instead of "in the low range," which sounds bizarre--but that is just me thinking in English, I suppose.

    El alumno obtuvo las siguientes puntuaciones: rango bajo en la lectura, rango promedio-bajo en las matemáticas y rango promedio en el lenguaje escrito.
    El alumno obtuvo los siguientes rangos de puntuación: bajo en la lectura, promedio-bajo en las matemáticas y promedio en el lenguaje escrito.
    Gotcha, thanks for the other suggestions Lnew!

    In Spain, with scholar subjects, we usually omit the article:

    ... bajo en lectura, promedio-bajo en matemáticas y promedio en lenguaje escrito.
    :thumbsup: También por aquí.
    That is super helpful to know, thank you guys! Here in Peru I think they usually use the article; at least that's what a Peruvian friend told me. But my translations are usually for a Mexican audience. So do you always omit the article then (except obviously if the academic subject is the subject of the sentence, such as "Las matemáticas me parecen interesantes")? For example: "El alumno tiene dificultades con matemáticas y lectura" or "Mi materia favorita son ciencias"?

    Another side question: I noticed that all of you used a hyphenated phrase for "low average": "promedio-bajo" or "medio-bajo." That surprised me because Spanish uses hyphens far less than in English. Does "low average" in this case then work like "pasivo-agresivo"? It uses a hyphen because the two words together form a single adjective?

    ¡Mil gracias de nuevo!
     

    S.V.

    Senior Member
    Español, México
    Oh, yes, like "you will get 100 in score," "I'm glad my NA S14 can get 99 in score" (web). Even if those sound fine, I guess "the student got in score a low average" still sounds odd (better the student got a low average score, a score of 68, etc.). I also thought of como (obtuvo como puntuación), but it sounded a bit odd, same reason as in "low average as a score". Anyway, that's beside the point. See Cuban solved it with a : :p

    Hm yes, articles are a bit complicated. Your original sentence works fine, it just sounds a bit crowded. Same as "The student scored in the low range in reading; in the low average range in math and in the average range in written language." It's correct, but not necessary. I think generally, in these "lists" we don't need to repeat prep + art, same as in English. Should be the same whenever you can use a colon, and just pronounce each item after a pause.

    Yes, we would say El alumno tiene dificultades con Matemáticas y Lectura (las also works there). Mi materia favorita es Ciencias works, and the plural for Mis materias favoritas son Historia, Matemáticas y Geografía. You could expect the plural verb with the article Mi materia favorita son las Matemáticas. Definite articles generally give more weight to the noun; nouns with no articles are stranger as subjects, like you point out, so ser agrees with the singular noun (since it's still just one school subject).
     
    Last edited:

    NinaDee

    Senior Member
    English - United States
    Your original sentence works fine, it just sounds a bit crowded. Same as "The student scored in the low range in reading; in the low average range in math and in the average range in written language." It's correct, but not necessary. I think generally, in these "lists" we don't need to repeat prep + art, same as in English. Should be the same whenever you can use a colon, and just pronounce each item after a pause.
    That makes sense, S.V., thank you. :tick:

    Mi materia favorita es Ciencias works, and the plural for Mis materias favoritas son Historia, Matemáticas y Geografía. You could expect the plural verb with the article Mi materia favorita son las Matemáticas. Definite articles generally give more weight to the noun; nouns with no articles are stranger as subjects, like you point out, so ser agrees with the singular noun (since it's still just one school subject).
    I have a question about this. The RAE says that when the singularity and plurality of the subject and predicate differ and the two are united by the verb "ser," the norm is to use "ser" in the plural: "c) Cuando el sujeto y el atributo son dos sustantivos que difieren en número, lo normal es establecer la concordancia con el elemento plural: «Mi infancia son recuerdos de un patio de Sevilla»(Machado Campos [Esp. 1907-17] 491); «Todo eso son falacias» (Ott Dientes [Ven. 1999]); «La primera causa de regresión de la especie son las alteraciones de su hábitat» (DNavarra [Esp.] 20.5.99). No obstante, en algunos casos es posible establecer la concordancia también en singular, en especial cuando uno de los dos sustantivos tiene significado colectivo, o cuando, siendo un plural morfológico, se refiere a un concepto unitario: «Quienes desarrollaron la cultura de La Venta era gente de habla maya» (Ruz Mayas [Méx. 1981]); «El sueldo es tres mil dólares al mes» (Donoso Elefantes [Chile 1995]); «Las migas ruleras es un postre que se reserva para la cena» (Vergara Comer [Esp. 1981])" (http://lema.rae.es/dpd/srv/search?id=4M7BtboGiD6n4FCqUu). Therefore, it doesn't seem like it should matter whether the article is in front of the academic subject or not; according to this RAE entry, it seems that "ser" should be in the plural form (son) regardless of if the article is there or not. Although changing "materia" to "clase," for example, would sound weird to me with the plural: "Mi clase favorita son (las) matemáticas." Thoughts?

    Lastly, what did you think of this issue:
    Another side question: I noticed that all of you used a hyphenated phrase for "low average": "promedio-bajo" or "medio-bajo." That surprised me because Spanish uses hyphens far less than in English. Does "low average" in this case then work like "pasivo-agresivo"? It uses a hyphen because the two words together form a single adjective?
    Thanks so much!
     

    S.V.

    Senior Member
    Español, México
    Yes, it would be the same as Social studies is my favorite class. That would be just the name of the class, same as Ciencias in Spanish. It does not refer to more than 1 school subject. With the article, we would also need Mi materia favorita son las ciencias. It mixes the contents of the class with its name, in a colloquial way. It would probably sound odd to other speakers with the plural first: Las ciencias son mi materia favorita; Matemáticas would be more common, being one of the few nouns that are rarely used in singular.

    I think promedio bajo just looks like bajo is an adjective for promedio, so the hyphen clarifies it's a range from average to low. I don't know what the RAE may advise in such cases. I understand your sentence could also use them? Hyphens are messy in English too! :D
     

    NinaDee

    Senior Member
    English - United States
    Ok, so to clarify: you can either say "Mi materia favorita son las ciencias" (plural verb + article) or "Mi materia favorita es ciencias" (singular verb without article)? Does the same work for "clase"? I.e. "Mi clase favorita son las ciencias" or "Mi clase favorita es ciencias"?

    I think promedio bajo just looks like bajo is an adjective for promedio, so the hyphen clarifies it's a range from average to low.
    I don't quite agree with you here, S.V. "Low average" in English means the low part of the average range. So in order from lowest to highest, you would have the low average, then the average, and then the high average. It's not a range from average to low. Would you still use the hyphen then? Thanks again! :)
     

    S.V.

    Senior Member
    Español, México
    Yes, clase doesn't change it. Las ciencias would be less common than las matemáticas, in there. Also shortened to mate (es mate).

    Yes, still with hyphen, as both words describe range. But you can use en el promedio bajo, if you want. Not clear on the rule.
     
    Last edited:

    NinaDee

    Senior Member
    English - United States
    Yes, clase doesn't change it.
    Oh ok, so "Mi clase favorita son las ciencias" and "Mi clase favorita es ciencias" both work. :tick:

    Yes, still with hyphen, as both words describe range.
    That makes sense. It then must form a compound adjective in Spanish.

    But you can use en el promedio bajo, if you want
    Yup, that's what I used originally. Thanks again for your help!
     
    < Previous | Next >
    Top