to rain (manna, questions)

What are the meanings of many languages' words equivalent to the English transitive verb "rain" in the below examples? :
1. "I'm going to rain food/manna from heaven for you." (Exodus 16:4)
2. rain questions/praises/criticisims on him
Thank you so much in advance for your kind help !
 
  • Awwal12

    Senior Member
    Russian
    Russian normally uses verbs derived from the -сып-(-syp-) root here (сыпать, засыпать, осыпать, обсыпать and similar ones). It represents a general equivalent of "pour" except it's used with loose materials which consist of numerous solid particles (salt, sand, sugar, flour, you name it).
     

    Perseas

    Senior Member
    In Modern Greek the verb "rain" is "βρέχω" [vréxo] and it couldn't work in 1. and 2. But the noun "βροχή" [vroçí] could work.
    In 2. , for example, you can say: βροχή ερωτήσεων/επαίνων/κριτικών (rain of questions/praises/criticisms).
     
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    Awwal12

    Senior Member
    Russian
    In Modern Greek the verb "rain" is "βρέχω [vréxo] and it couldn't work in 1. and 2. But the noun "βροχή [vroçí] could work.
    In 2. , for example, you can say: βροχή ερωτήσεων/επαίνων/κριτικών (rain of questions/praises/criticisms).
    If anything, in Russian it would be "hail" ("град") but not "rain".
     

    Encolpius

    Senior Member
    Hungarian
    Interesting, I learnt something new today, I have not known rain can be a transitive word.

    to rain somebody is translated as "to flood somebody" [Hungarian: eláraszt]

    I wonder what verb you use in Japanese.
     
    Interesting, I learnt something new today, I have not known rain can be a transitive word.

    to rain somebody is translated as "to flood somebody" [Hungarian: eláraszt]

    I wonder what verb you use in Japanese.
    Regarding the case of raining manna, the verb is "fura-seru (seru < suru < su = do/make + furu = fall_from_heaven, but most probably originally swing/shake: In modern Japanese "Ame ga futte iru. = Rain-water is falling." but probably originally "Heaven [Ame] is shaking [the rain-water off and down].").
    In the case of raining questions, blames, etc., it's "ame arare to (like/as rain-water and/or hails) abi-seru/abi-se-kakeru (make_bathe_in/pour_on/flood)".

    漢字カナ混じり文では、
    降らせる。    雨が降っている。< 天(あめ)が振っている。 
    雨あられと(雨霰 [= 雨かんむり+散る]  と)浴びせる・浴びせかける。
     
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    ThomasK

    Senior Member
    Belgium, Dutch
    Very pleased to have a Japanese around again!

    However, this causative is unknown to us in Dutch. For (1) we use "laten regenen" (let rain), which sounds quite different, I do find "I will rain manna" in (some) English and AmeriBible translations . As for (2) I think of "overladen" (surcharged/...), which as a metaphor makes it looks as if compliments or congratulations are heavy. I cannot think of a "fluid metaphor" that would fit in. ( "Overspoelen" (wash over) exists, but then you get drowned - and so it is not the right word here, more for criticisms...)
     
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    Regarding the case of raining manna, the verb is "fura-seru (seru < suru < su = do/make + furu = fall_from_heaven, but most probably originally swing/shake: In modern Japanese "Ame ga futte iru. = Rain-water is falling." but probably originally "Heaven [Ame] is shaking [the rain-water off and down].").
    In the case of raining questions, blames, etc., it's "ame arare to (like/as rain-water and/or hails) abi-seru/abi-se-kakeru (make_bathe_in/pour_on/flood)".

    漢字カナ混じり文では、
    降らせる。    雨が降っている。< 天(あめ)が振っている。 
    雨あられと(雨霰 [= 雨かんむり+散る]  と)浴びせる・浴びせかける。
     『広辞苑』にも、『てにをは辞典』(The Japanese Collocations Dictionary) にも、『てにをは表現辞典』(The Japanese Collocations Thesaurus) にも、講談社『類語大辞典』にも、角川書店『類語新辞典』にも、「雨霰と浴びせる・浴びせかける」は載っていません。
     けれども、『ジーニアス英和大辞典』(大修館書店)の rain  の訳に、「(盛んに)浴びせる・浴びせかける」が出ています。また、『現代独和辞典』(三修社)には、"Es regnete Briefe/Ohrfeige/Vorwürfe. " の訳文として、「どんどん手紙が来た。 鉄拳が雨あられと降った。 轟轟(ごうごう)たる非難だった。」というのが掲げてあります。
     

    ThomasK

    Senior Member
    Belgium, Dutch
    It is not quite clear to me why you add all the comments in Japanese. I think most people at AL do not understand it, and in general you are quite welcome to write examples or phrases you're referring to in Japanese, but not the comments… Thanks in advance...

    As far as I can see from the examples quoted, there are no causative forms: German uses the common "rain" verb, and there seems to be a problem with the translation into Japanese, but from the Google T version I cannot quite understand what precisely…
     

    Circunflejo

    Senior Member
    Castellano de Castilla
    1. Haré que llueva maná del cielo para ti.
    2. We can't use the verb to rain here. We should use the noun (lluvia) and another verb like hacer (make/do). Hazle una lluvia de preguntas/elogios/críticas. Assuming there are lot of them, it may be more idiomatic to use aluvión instead of lluvia but aluvión isn't related with rain/raining.
     

    ThomasK

    Senior Member
    Belgium, Dutch
    I' be interested to hear about the precise differences of lluvia (just rain, or stronger?) an aluvion (floods?). Thanks in advance...

    Just BTW: when thinking very abstractly, I consider it strange to causativ-ise 'rain" because it is impersonal (it rains). But maybe it is not so much different from fall/ fell, lie/ lay, etc. Just wondering...
     
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    Circunflejo

    Senior Member
    Castellano de Castilla
    I' be interested to hear about the precise differences of lluvia (just rain, or stronger?) an aluvion (floods?).
    Básically, you got it. Lluvia is just rain and aluvión is a sudden river flood that drags gravel, mud, sediments… The dragged sediments themselves can be called aluvión too. Figuratively, it's used for a big influx of anything (in this case of questions/praises/criticisms).
     
    It is not quite clear to me why you add all the comments in Japanese. I think most people at AL do not understand it, and in general you are quite welcome to write examples or phrases you're referring to in Japanese, but not the comments… Thanks in advance...

    As far as I can see from the examples quoted, there are no causative forms: German uses the common "rain" verb, and there seems to be a problem with the translation into Japanese, but from the Google T version I cannot quite understand what precisely…
    The reason for the introduction of Japanese verb phrases is that/because Mr. Encolpius asked for the Japanese versions at the end of post #5.
     

    ThomasK

    Senior Member
    Belgium, Dutch
    There is no problem with the quotation of the verb phrases at all, you know, please do not misunderstand! (But I'll send you a pm)

    As a matter of fact, your explanation of the Japanese words is very interesting!
     
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    Welsh_Sion

    Senior Member
    Welsh - Northern
    Welsh

    Usually, bwrw (= 'to cast')

    to rain
    (blood, ashes, kisses, blows Etc): bwrw, syrthio yn gawod ( = fall in a shower), disgyn yn gawod (ibid.)
    blows rained upon him syrthiodd ergydion yn gawod arno (= blows fell on him in a shower), to rain blows on someone dyrnu rhywun yn ddidrugaredd ( = to use one's fists on someone with no mercy)
    tears rained down her cheeks 'roedd dagrau'n powlio i lawr ei gruddiau (= tears were running down her cheeks) , 'roedd dagrau'n llifo i lawr ei gruddiau (= tears were flowing down her cheeks)

    Geiriadur yr Academi | The Welsh Academy English-Welsh Dictionary Online
     

    ThomasK

    Senior Member
    Belgium, Dutch
    Very pleased to have a Japanese around again!

    However, this causative is unknown to us in Dutch. For (1) we use "laten regenen" (let rain), which sounds quite different, I do find "I will rain manna" in (some) English and AmeriBible translations . As for (2) I think of "overladen" (surcharged/...), which as a metaphor makes it looks as if compliments or congratulations are heavy. I cannot think of a "fluid metaphor" that would fit in. ( "Overspoelen" (wash over) exists, but then you get drowned - and so it is not the right word here, more for criticisms...)
    I should have mentioned as for (2) that we can say: "Het regent kritiek [op hem????]" (It is raining criticisms)
     

    Kaoss

    Senior Member
    Spanish-Spain
    1. Haré que llueva maná del cielo para ti.
    2. We can't use the verb to rain here. We should use the noun (lluvia) and another verb like hacer (make/do). Hazle una lluvia de preguntas/elogios/críticas. Assuming there are lot of them, it may be more idiomatic to use aluvión instead of lluvia but aluvión isn't related with rain/raining.
    Regarding 2. I disagree with circunflejo. The verb form can be used: "Le llovieron las críticas (...)".
     

    Penyafort

    Senior Member
    Catalan (Catalonia), Spanish (Spain)
    In Catalan, Exodus 16:4 is translated as:

    Us faré ploure pa del cel.
    To-you I-will-make to-rain bread from-the sky.

    In Catalan, as in the rest of Romance languages, causatives are mostly formed with the verb 'to make' (fer) + the infinitive.
     

    Circunflejo

    Senior Member
    Castellano de Castilla
    Regarding 2. I disagree with circunflejo. The verb form can be used: "Le llovieron las críticas (...)".
    Yes, that's right but it's different. I mean what I said in 10 puts the focus on the person that criticizes (who starts the rain) and what you say put the focus on the destinatary of the critics (who gets wet with the rain, so to speak). For some reason that I don't recall now, I thought that @kimko_379 was interested on the former and not on the latter but, of course, I could be wrong.
     
    Interesting, I learnt something new today, I have not known rain can be a transitive word.

    to rain somebody is translated as "to flood somebody" [Hungarian: eláraszt]

    I wonder what verb you use in Japanese.
    Mx. Encolpius, I wonder which is the Hungarian verb corresponding to "let/make/cause_to rain (down)/fall" or "send down" in this verse, please?:
    4 És monda az Úr Mózesnek: Ímé én esőképen bocsátok néktek kenyeret az égből; menjen ki azért a nép és szedjen naponként arra a napra valót, hogy megkísértsem: akar-é az én törvényem szerint járni, vagy nem?
    Thank you so much in advance for your kind reply.
     
    Mx. Encolpius, I wonder which is the Hungarian verb corresponding to "let/make/cause_to rain (down)/fall" or "send down" in this verse, please?:
    4 És monda az Úr Mózesnek: Ímé én esőképen bocsátok néktek kenyeret az égből; menjen ki azért a nép és szedjen naponként arra a napra valót, hogy megkísértsem: akar-é az én törvényem szerint járni, vagy nem?
    Thank you so much in advance for your kind reply.
    Judging from an online English-Hungarian Dictionary entry, I roughly/vaguely understand that "esőképen" is the word meaning "rain" or "rain/send down," right?
     
    Yes, that's right but it's different. I mean what I said in 10 puts the focus on the person that criticizes (who starts the rain) and what you say put the focus on the destinatary of the critics (who gets wet with the rain, so to speak). For some reason that I don't recall now, I thought that @kimko_379 was interested on the former and not on the latter but, of course, I could be wrong.
    Muchas gracias, todos! Thanks to you, I have found both focus-info-pieces so intriguing, although I had not even thought or dreamed of/imagined any such possible nuance between the two.
     

    ain'ttranslationfun?

    Senior Member
    US English
    What are the meanings of many languages' words equivalent to the English transitive verb "rain" in the below examples? :
    1. "I'm going to rain food/manna from heaven for you." (Exodus 16:4)
    2. rain questions/praises/criticisims on him
    Thank you so much in advance for your kind help !

    1; "I am going to [I don't think contractions are used in the Bible (or other religious texts)] pour/[shower?] food /manna [down] on you."
    2. sounds OK (or maybe "hail", as Awwal writes in #4 is said in Russian -- but doesn't "hail" imply aggression?). In addition to your post (we assume there is a subject before 'rain' right?), we can use the passive voice, but not with 'rain': "He was pelted with questions." (FWIW.)
     
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    Yendred

    Senior Member
    Français - France
    In French, we say "faire pleuvoir" (lit. to "make rain") for a transitive use of the verb pleuvoir (to rain), which by itself is intransitive.
    1. Je ferai pleuvoir pour vous du pain, du haut des cieux (Exode 16:4, Sainte-Bible, 1910 translation)
    2. Faire pleuvoir des questions, des louanges, des critiques sur lui.

    The verb pleuvoir is said to be "impersonnel", that is it can only be used in the infinitive (pleuvoir) or in the third person (il pleut).
     
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    In French, we say "faire pleuvoir" (lit. to "make rain") for a transitive use of the verb pleuvoir (to rain), which by itself is intransitive.
    1. Je ferai pleuvoir pour vous du pain, du haut des cieux (Exode 16:4, Sainte-Bible, 1910 translation)
    2. Faire pleuvoir des questions, des louanges, des critiques sur lui.

    The verb pleuvoir is said to be "impersonnel", that is it can only be used in the infinitive (pleuvoir) or in the third person (il pleut).
    Thanks. And the "il" originally meant "God". (But now "the atmosphere" or "the surroundings".)
    In addition: You say, "Il pleuve dans mon cœur. (= It rains/sheds tears in my heart.)"
     
    1; "I am going to [I don't think contractions are used in the Bible (or other religious texts)] pour/[shower?] food /manna [down] on you."
    2. sounds OK (or maybe "hail", as Awwal writes in #4 is said in Russian -- but doesn't "hail" imply agression?). In addition to your post (we assume there is a subject before 'rain' right?), we can use the passive voice, but not with 'rain': "He was pelted with questions." (FWIW.)
    Thanks. But yes: the whole 1. sentence in my original post was a quotation from my Bible: "Life Application Study Bible, Personal Size Edition" (Tindale Publishing); I strongly/highly recommend it to you, too.
     

    Yendred

    Senior Member
    Français - France
    And the "il" originally meant "God"
    If you accept that this "God" varies between eras. This construction comes from Latin, where the apparent(*) subject was considered to be Jupiter.

    (*) apparent is quite an oxymoron to speak of an Entity which never reveals Itself 🙄
     
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