Ukranian: Pronunciation of '

blazze

New Member
Polish
So I've recently started learning Ukrainian and I know that the apostrophe "indicates that the consonant it follows isn't palatalised".
I understand it in theory, but, in practice, does Ukrainian really distinguish between, say, /vʲ/ in морквяний and /vj/ in черв'як?
I've read in different sources that it doesn't matter and even native speakers have problems with spelling, and indeed if you search for "морквяний" in Google the first result is "Морквяний чи моркв'яний як правильно?". On the other hand, when I listen to words spelt with an apostrophe, it seems to me like there's something like an i between the consonant and the vowel, so п'ю sounds somewhat like пію? (which would correspond to, for example, Polish or Czech pije).
Can someone tell me how you correctly pronounce that?
 
  • Selyd

    Senior Member
    ucraniano
    We say
    морквя́ни́й, морко́в’яний, моркв’яни́й.
    Norma = морквя́ни́й.
     

    Panceltic

    Senior Member
    Slovenščina
    According to Wikipedia, the sounds /mʲ/, /pʲ/, /bʲ/, /fʲ/ and /vʲ/ don't even exist in Ukrainian. If this is correct, then it shouldn't matter how you pronounce the words in question as there is no confusion.

    I don't have much experience with Ukrainian though, just my tuppence.
     

    Selyd

    Senior Member
    ucraniano
    морквя́ни́й end моркв’яни́й
    I will pronounce in different ways (вя́/в’я).
     

    Saley

    Senior Member
    Russian, Ukrainian
    Welcome to the forum, blazze! Finally someone asked about Ukrainian.
    does Ukrainian really distinguish between, say, /vʲ/ in морквяний and /vj/ in черв'як?
    Pronouncing черв’як as червяк is incorrect in any case. You can hear many people say моркв’яний, but the literary norm is морквяний (avoiding too many consonants in a row).
    when I listen to words spelt with an apostrophe, it seems to me like there's something like an i between the consonant and the vowel, so п'ю sounds somewhat like пію
    As a native speaker I don’t perceive any vowel between [p] and [j]. Actually there’s a phonemic difference between /pj/ and /pij/, e.g. ви́п’ю [ˈʋɪ.pju] (= wypiję, I’ll drink) vs. ко́пію [ˈkɔ.pʲi.ju] (= kopię, a copy).
    According to Wikipedia, the sounds /mʲ/, /pʲ/, /bʲ/, /fʲ/ and /vʲ/ don't even exist in Ukrainian.
    It’s common not to count palatalized labials as separate phonemes, but both hard and soft sounds exist as allophones.
     
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