Urdu, Hindi: ‘kar’ meaning ‘by’?

[tolxeta]

I’m aware of the use of کر kar as a conjunctive implying sequentiality, where what follows comes after what precedes it, sometimes with a cause and effect relationship and sometimes without any such relationship.

I’ve come across some uses of کر (and when following the stem of karnaa, کے ke) where it might best be translated as ‘by’, e.g. from Beginning Urdu A Complete Course by Pien & Farooqui p545:

اس لیے میں ہندوستان جا کر، خود تجربہ کر کے اس کے بارے میں جاننا چاہتا تھا​

"is liye maiN hinduustaan jaa kar, xud tajurba kar ke is ke baare meN jaannaa chaahtaa thaa"
"Therefore I wanted to know about it by going to India [and] by experiencing [for] myself"

and from the same book p546:

اس وقت میں نے سوچا کہ شاید ہندوستان آ کر میں نے غلطی کی ہے​

"us vaqt maiN ne sochaa ke shaayad hinduustaan aa kar maiN ne Ghalatii kii hai"
"At that time/moment I thought that maybe I have made a mistake by coming to India"

In both examples, it seems that the relationship between what precedes and follows کر is that of the latter being a means of the former, the 1st example implying the latter actually precedes the former (go to and experience India, and hence gain knowledge), as opposed to the usual implication of کر, and the 2nd example implying the former is the manifestaiton of the latter (coming to India being the mistake).

Can anyone elaborate on this usage of کر? Further examples, rules for how and when it can/should be used to mean ‘by’, how to distinguish its use cases from those of other possible translations of ‘by’ conveying a similar meaning, etc? E.g. how similar is it to کے ذریعے ke zarii3e - what precise rules distinguish their use cases and do they have any in common? The same book p507 translates:

(سے) ہو کر via, by way of

so in what sort of phrases would you use that?

 

[Qureshpor]

Hindi-Urdu: Conjuct 'Kar/Ke'

Please take a look at # 7 and then get back to me if there are any further queries.

By theway, you need to name the language in the title of your post.

 

[tolxeta]

Hindi-Urdu: Conjuct 'Kar/Ke'

Please take a look at # 7 and then get back to me if there are any further queries.

By theway, you need to name the language in the title of your post.

بہت شکریہ​

I take it the relevant examples there are no 1) and 5), which are apparently both from songs. This might be a good oppurtunity to ask: how much do Urdu/Hindi songs conform to the rules of grammar? I assume it's something that varies from language to language.
Anyhow, further examples are welcome, along with elaborating on the rules/use cases, distinguishing factors etc as mentioned in OP.

 

[Qureshpor]

I shall only comment upon Urdu. You will find works of most if not all Urdu song writers in the archives of Urdu poetry. Sahir Ludhianvi, Kaifi Azmi, Hasrat Jaipuri, Shakeel Badayuni just to name a few. Their use of language would pass all the rules of grammar.

"likh kar" essentially means "having written" where this contruction is used to express two closely connected consecutive events. So in the right context, one can express this meaning in Englisah by...

1. wrote (vu yih likh kar bolaa... He wrote this and spoke)

2. After writing

3. By writing ... etc

 

[MonsieurGonzalito]

"At that time/moment I thought that maybe I have made a mistake by coming to India"

rules for how and when it can/should be used to mean ‘by’, how to distinguish its use cases from those of other possible translations of ‘by’ conveying a similar meaning, etc?

Notice that the translation "by coming to India" is mostly an idiomatic, relatively stylistic English translation of "hinduustaan aa kar". The literal translation would have been "having come to India".

"kar", strictly speaking, only indicates a sequence of events. If it is obvious that the first action can be rethorically considered a conduit or instrument for the second, then using "by" in the translation is acceptable. Otherwise, it isn't.

For example, in: terii bholii baateN sun kar aksar maiN haNstaa thaa
I would not translate using "by listening", because the innocent talk, although it causes it, is not a conduit or instrument for my smiling.

how much do Urdu/Hindi songs conform to the rules of grammar?

They conform plenty.
All I know about Hindi/Urdu, for what it is worth, I learned by listening to songs (gaane sun kar 😊), and then asking in this forum what they meant.