Urdu, Hindi: baraat yaa baaraat?

Discussion in 'Indo-Iranian Languages' started by Qureshpor, Feb 12, 2013.

  1. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    For a wedding procession, do you say "baraat" or "baaraat"? Which of the two is considered "preferred" pronunciation? Again, if possible, could you please quote usage of both of the terms.
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2013
  2. greatbear Banned

    India - Hindi & English
    "baaraat" is often heard, but I've always taken it to be a corruption of "baraat". Anyway, to my ears, "baraat" sounds nicer.

    As Shamshad Begum memorably sings, "chaandnii raat hogii/taaroN kii baraat hogii // pehle pehle pyaar kii/pehlii pehlii baat hogii".
  3. tonyspeed Senior Member

    English & Creole - Jamaica
    GB's point makes much sense.

    S ورات व्रात vrāt, s.m. An assemblage, a company, troop, multitude, flock;

    By process of Prakritisation:
    vraat --- (inability to say v)-> braat -------(dislike for word-initial conjuncts)-> baraat ---(vowel change corruption)--->baaraat
  4. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    In Urdu, both "baraaT" and "baaraat" are used. An example of the former is well known autobiography of the poet Josh Maleehabadi (yaadoN kii baraat) and of the latter, from a Ghazal by Raj Kumar "Qais".

    dekh , tire diivaanoN kii ab jaan pih kyaa ban aa'ii hai
    chup saadheN to dam ghuTtaa hai boleN to rusvaa'ii hai

    dil apnaa sunsaan nagar hai phir bhii kitnii raunaq hai
    sapnoN kii baaraat sajii hai, yaadoN kii shahnaa'ii hai
  5. greatbear Banned

    India - Hindi & English
    Why do I often get the idea, QP, that you pose questions, then you answer them yourselves (without even sometimes noticing what others have said or answered). It seems like you open a thread for yourself, isn't it? Do you feel the same?
  6. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    If one reads my opening post it would become clear to any fair minded person that I have not yet answered my own question because I have not indicated how I use this word! Around 6 weeks of the new year have gone by and I would like the rest of the year and the years to come to pass by in a friendly and harmonious manner, with all members of the forum. I am saying this with the utmost sincerity.
  7. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    I'm used to baaraat. I'll try to provide some attested instances later in the evening.
  8. greatbear Banned

    India - Hindi & English
    Was the question how you use the word? Any "fair minded person" can see you asked for a listing of quotations; then, you proceeded to list them after a post or two. Is this forum for discussing literature or languages? Granted that the two are often inseparable, but in this thread and in many others, your only intention is that people come up with thousands of quotations from literature: there is no question!

    I also would like the years to come by in a friendly and harmonious manner; I am merely pointing out that when you start a thread, you should have a sincere question in mind.
  9. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I now follow the main reason for the contention. It is good to cite examples and more often than not these are not so easy to find in the form of the spoken word. In this instance we do have songs such as..

    raajaa kii aa'e gii baaraat
    raNgiilii ho gii raat
    magan maiN naachuuN gii


    yaadoN kii baaraat niklii hai aaj dil ke dvaare
    sapnoN kii shahnaa'ii biite dinoN ko pukaare

    But in the absence of audio/video citations one has to turn to the written word. Those who are familiar with Urdu are fortunate because there is no dearth of literary sources to quote from. And that is what I and others do to illustrate authoritative usage through the works of our foremost writers. A recent example was the use of "maiN jaanuuN" for "I reckon". I seek Hindi and Punjabi speakers' indulgence in the same vein, if it is at all possible. My questions and answers are sincere. I can not say more than this.

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