Urdu-Persian-Arabic: تیار

Discussion in 'Indo-Iranian Languages' started by Qureshpor, Feb 8, 2013.

  1. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    The word تیار is used in Urdu frequently and is pronounced "taiyyaar", although Platts gives the pronunciation as "taiyaar". It means ready, as in "The food is ready" or "We are ready to go". I have seen it written as طیار. Platts gives its origins to be Arabic whilst Hayyim has his doubts and gives its pronunciation as "tiyaar".I have to confess that in my limited readings of Persian literature, I have not come across the word. Wehr's Arabic-English gives تیار 's meaning to be connected with electric current and طیار with flying! Here is an entry from Steingass..

    taiyār, tayār (from A.طیّار ready to fly, fledged), Ready, prepared;--taiyār kardan, To make ready, prepare.

    I am curious as to where this word really comes from and what its actual pronunciation is or was. Any examples from Persian or Arabic literature would be helpful (we have plenty of examples in Urdu literature).
  2. Jervoltage Senior Member

    From Dehkhoda:
    /طَی یار/
    در غیاث اللغات و آنندراج آمده که : فارسیان لفظ طیار را مجازاً بمعنی مهیا و آماده و مستعد استعمال کنند و تحقیق آنست که این لفظ در اصل اصطلاح قوشچیان یعنی میرشکاران است که چون جانوران شکاری از گریز برآمده مستعد و آمادۀ پرواز و شکاراندازی میشوند گویند این جانور طیارشد، چون به این معنی شهرت گرفته مجازاً هر شی ء مهیارا طیار گویند و به تاء فوقانی نوشتن فارسی بودن این لفظ محل تأمل است .ا

    چو طیار کردی خدنگ نگاه
    به استادیت تیرگر شد گواه
    محمدسعید اشرف
    Hope it helps.
  3. Alfaaz Senior Member

    Could someone translate the entry from Dekhoda provided by Jervoltage into English...? Thanks!

    Just in case it helps, quote from OUD (it does have mistakes sometimes, as we have observed in this forum):
    Entered Urdu via Farsi. The altered form (ت → ط) of the Ism-e-mubaalighah (اسمِ مبالغہ) taiyyar (طیّار) from Arabic was used in Farsi and from Farsi entered Urdu without alteration. First used in 1786 in Mathnawiyaat-e-Hassan.

    The اسمِ مبالغہ was briefly discussed here in IIL and here in the Arabic forum. Considering the examples given there, what is the element of repetition giving طیّار the meaning related to flying?
  4. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    Thank you Jervoltage. This is extremely helpful and logical explanation.

    Here is an attempt. I hope you have your magnifying glass with you!:) I have n't translated the couplet.

    It is given in Ghiyaasu_lluGhaat and Anand Raj that Persian speakers use the word "taiyyaar" metaphorically in the sense of "muhaiyyaa", "aamaadah" and "musta3id". Research shows that this word in reality is part of the idiom of falconers, that is to say huntsmen. When birds of prey, after having moulted are prepared and ready to fly and hunt, it is said this animal is "taiyyaar". When this meaning became popular, metaphorically everything that was ready was called "taiyyaar". Writing with a "taa-i-fauqaanii" to impart Persian-ness to this word, is a cause for reflection.

    Edit: The word is not "gurez" but "kurez" (moulting)

    aaqaa-ye-Jervoltage. Are you able to provide any examples of "taiyyaar" from your Classical and/or modern literature?
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 10, 2013
  5. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    This is a very enlightening thread about a word that is used over and over in Urdu and in Hindi. I have no reason to question the explanation given in Dehkhoda, more so, I find it just perfect as it refers to some scholars who I suppose had more to do with falconers than we at present do! I consider it as a full explanation. I have to confess that I'd been guessing the word was of Prakrit, not of Arabic or Persian origins. This thead has opened my eyes.

    Since the puzzle is solved (I think), could you all please come forward with some synonyms to ''ready'' like in ''I am ready to depart'', ''the food is ready'' in Urdu, Persian or Arabic?
  6. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    khaanaa Haazir hai

    maiN ne ravaanah hone ko kamar baaNdh lii hai.
  7. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    Here is an attempt at translating the quoted couplet.

    چو طیار کردی خدنگ نگاه
    به استادیت تیرگر شد گواه

    When you saddled up the steed of your vision
    To your mastery, the archer became a witness

    Muhammad Sa3iid Ashraf
  8. Faylasoof Senior Member

    Plato's Republic
    English (UK) & Urdu (Luckhnow), Hindi
    The origin is generally considered to be Arabic, here, except in the original it is indeed all about flying as it is derived from the verb طَيّرَ Tayyara (form II) = to make fly, send up flying etc. I was reading an account of the Battle of Badr where I read this:
    فَضَرَبَهُ وطَيّرَ لُبَّهُ = He then struck him and made his brains fly!

    طَيّرَ -> طَیّار

    طَیّار Tayyaar = flyer / one who can fly (in Classical Arabic); aviator, pilot (MSA).

    In Classical Arabic literature, الطيّار aT-Tayyaar is the specific appellation of Ja3far ibn Abi Talib, the Prophet’s cousin (who was almost his age) and the elder brother of Imam Ali. He was killed at Battle of Mu’tah after a group of Byzantine soldiers surrounded him and severed both his arms before dispartching him off. When the Prophet heard of his death he was much grieved and dreamt him being in Paradise and that he had grown wings. Henceforth he was called جعفر الطيّار ja3far aT-Tayyaar .

    As the above link to the online Urdu lexicon elaborates (and as I've read elsewhere), the word entered Persian from Arabic where a ط T to ت t shift took place before we got the word tayyaar - and it is تَیّار tayyaar, not taiyaar. At least that is how it is supposed to be pronounced in Urdu though I've heard the latter too.
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2013

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