where is the subject< here comes the man> ??

Acronym

New Member
Arabic
Hello everyone,

While reading some material I was confused trying to figure out which phrase does function as the subject of the sentenc? and why?

The sentences are:

A.Here comes the man.

B.There is more than one way to the city.

I think in sentence A, Here functions as the subject because it preceds the verb,
and in B, There functions as the subject for the same reason

what do you think everyone.
 
  • deddish

    Senior Member
    English
    In those cases neither of your guesses are correct. HERE could only be the subject of A if it was re-written as "The man comes here." THERE could be the subject of B if it was re-written as something closer to "THERE are the ways into the city", as in someone indicating on a map.

    The subject of the sentences are MAN and WAY.
    Here comes WHO? The man. There is more than one WHAT? Way into the city.
     

    Joelline

    Senior Member
    American English
    Subjects can come after verbs or before verbs, so placement won't necessarily help.

    Easy general rule to remember: Here and there will not be the subjects of sentences.

    Now, I'll bet someone comes along with an exception! Don't worry about it; the exceptions will be so rare that you don't even have to think about them!
     

    deddish

    Senior Member
    English
    It's not a rare exception though.

    "Let's go there!" THERE is the subject, which is meaning a location that has already been established. It is used a lot in dialogue:
    "I want to go to the Pie Place."
    "But there's free pie at Pie Kingdom! Let's go THERE instead!"

    Or as a command:

    "Come HERE!"

    However, your rule does apply to THERE at least if you think about it as: "Is THERE replacing a pre-established place?" In a "there is" or "there are" sentence THERE will not be the subject (assuming that there is only one THERE in the sentence). In a sentence beginning with HERE it will not be the subject.
     

    dwipper

    Senior Member
    U.S. English
    deddish said:
    "Let's go there!" THERE is the subject, which is meaning a location that has Or
    ...
    "Come HERE!"

    This is not actually an exception. Since these sentences are in the imperative mood, the subject is not usually be stated. "(You) come here." 'You' is the subject, not 'here.'
     

    Txiri

    Senior Member
    USA English
    deddish said:
    " THERE could be the subject of B if it was re-written as something closer to "THERE are the ways into the city", as in someone indicating on a map.

    What looks like the complement, because it comes after the verb, is still the subject: Ways into the city are there.
     
    If you talk about grammatical functions, here and there are not subjects but adverbials of place. If you see sentence like this: Come here!, you have to conclude that the subject is the person that the sentence refers to. In Polish we call it "supposed subject". I don't know yet how it's called in English.
     

    Acronym

    New Member
    Arabic
    thanx everyone for your enthusiasm,

    I have several points I want to make clear.

    When I said the subject, I was referring to the function not to the notion of the subject.
    Therefore,

    Here comes the man, Here is in the subject position, before the verb,

    Here and There can take both the positions of subject as well as object,

    for example,

    I went there, There is the object, and There is a nice place, There is the subject.

    So, I think in A Here is the subject, because it precedes the verb be.
    and in B There is the subject for the same reason.

    What do you think?
     
    No. In the sentence I went there the subject is I, went is a predicate and there is, I think, object. English is a SVO language but that does not mean that if you put here in the beginning it's a subject. There are of course exceptions, like for instance: Seldom do you take photos in winter. Neither seldom nor do is a subject but you despite the fact that it's not in the beginning.
     

    Joelline

    Senior Member
    American English
    If you are speaking of grammatical function, then let me repeat it one more time: HERE and THERE cannot have the grammatical function of subjects! POSITION is irrelevant in determining the subject as majlo has shown!

    Look at this sentence, "In the doctor's office, on the wall were several posters." The subject is the last word in the sentence: POSTERS is the subject and WERE is the verb! Position of words is irrelevant in English when you are trying to identify subjects and verbs.

    Your last post makes me quite sad because it shows that you have understood nothing and learned nothing here.
     

    Txiri

    Senior Member
    USA English
    Acronym said:


    When I said the subject, I was referring to the function not to the notion of the subject.
    Therefore,

    Here comes the man, Here is in the subject position, before the verb,

    Here and There can take both the positions of subject as well as object,

    for example,

    I went there, There is the object, and There is a nice place, There is the subject.

    So, I think in A Here is the subject, because it precedes the verb be.
    and in B There is the subject for the same reason.

    Wrong. Absolutely incorrect.

    Words and phrases do have functions in sentences in English. We do not speak of "notions" which they have.

    "I went there". I tells who, went tells what the subject did, THERE tells where the subject went. "There" is an adverb.

    "Here comes the man," The subject is man, comes tells what he did, HERE tells where he comes. HERE is an adverb.

    All of the above descriptions identify the parts of the sentence by their function. All sentences in English will always have at least two parts: a subject and a conjugated verb.

    Here is another way to look at FUNCTION:

    They gave us the books.

    They is the subject, they tells who did the action; gave is the conjugated verb, it tells what action they did; books is the direct object, it tells what they gave; us is the indirect object, it tells TO WHOM they gave xxx.

    I know what they said.

    I is the subject, I tells who knows, knows is the conjugated verb. "What they said" is a dependent clause (the subject of the dependent clause is "they", "said" tells what they did) and the FUNCTION of the dependent clause is to tell "what I know." This clause FUNCTIONS as the direct object of the verb "know" and it is therefore a NOUN CLAUSE.

    Function depends on what information each part plays in the sentence, what each word or phrase contributes to the whole sentence.
     

    Acronym

    New Member
    Arabic
    First of all I thank you all for your attempts to help me grasp the answer.
    As for Joelline, thank you for your high manners, and save the sympathy for yourself please.

    When I talked about the FUNCTION of the subject I meant that the subject does not mean the topic of the sentence nor the doer of the action.

    For example:

    Nothing worries these kids.
    The subject is Nothing, and the topic is the Kids.

    Also,

    The apples were eaten by the bird.
    Here the subject is The apples in which are not the action doer.

    One thing more,

    Into the room runs the dog.

    The prepositional phrase, into the room, functions as the subject of the clause.

    Thanks.
     

    Joelline

    Senior Member
    American English
    Into the room runs the dog.

    The prepositional phrase, into the room, functions as the subject of the clause.

    Wrong again!

    Dog = subject
    runs = verb
    "into the room" = prepositional phrase which cannot / does not function as the subject of the sentence.

    Please re-read Txiri's first post above.
     

    mjscott

    Senior Member
    American English
    Sorry, acronym, but Into the room runs the dog--into the room is NOT the subject!

    WHAT runs? The dog runs. into the room is an adverb prepositional phrase--describing WHERE the dog runs.
     

    Txiri

    Senior Member
    USA English
    Acronym said:
    When I talked about the FUNCTION of the subject I meant that the subject does not mean the topic of the sentence nor the doer of the action.

    For example:

    Nothing worries these kids.
    The subject is Nothing, and the topic is the Kids.

    Also,

    The apples were eaten by the bird.
    Here the subject is The apples in which are not the action doer.

    One thing more,

    Into the room runs the dog.

    The prepositional phrase, into the room, functions as the subject of the clause.

    Thanks.

    I wonder if you're mistranslating the names of the parts of speech from Arabic?

    In,
    "Nothing worries these kids."
    The subject is Nothing, and the topic is the Kids."

    The subject of the sentence is "nothing", the verb is "worries" and the direct object is "kids."

    There isn´t any reason why abstract nouns cannot function as a subject. The topic of the sentence is the "subject matter" or "theme" regarding the information content conveyed by the sentence.

    In,
    "The apples were eaten by the bird."

    Apples is the subject, the conjugated verb is "were", used in the passive voice, hence the construction requires a past participle indicating the nature of the passive action, and finally "by the bird" is a prepositional phrase which specifies the agent of the passive action.

    In,
    "Into the room runs the dog."

    The subject is dog, runs tells what the dog does, "into the room" is a prepositional phrase that tells where the dog runs. If we pare the sentence down to its absolute minimum, the sentence reads, The dog runs. "Into the room" has no function other than to tell WHERE the dog runs, and any word or phrase that tells HOW, WHERE, WHEN, has an adverbial function.

    Although English speakers may intuit a preferred word order, as long as the necessary parts of speech are there (subject, conjugated verb at its simplest; object as well if the verb is transitive), word order may be flexible. Inversion of word order most often obeys certain wishes of the speaker to diverge from the norm, such as what happens with poetry.
     
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