22caps said:
Hey, I don't speak German at all, but I was wondering if someone could explain to me why German, of all other languages, changes the most between languages.
For instance... English = German.... Spanish = Alemán.... Italian = Tedesco... German = Deutsche (sp?)...
Whereas for, let's say, Spanish.... English = Spanish.... Spanish = Español.... Italian = Spagnolo.... French = Espagnole.....
They are all very similar for other languages, just not German. Anybody know the origin or reason of this?
Very interesting question - and even more interesting answers...
May I support you a little bit:
Ralf wrote:
Well, I think the answer dates back some 2,000 years rather than can be found 200 years ago. The German spoken in various German states didn't differ that much.
The German dialects are
very different from each other, they always have been. Only because of the fact that writing and reading became more popular and necessary, the dialects "unitised", kind of, on the basis of standard grammars.
As the German speaking areas were untited not before 1871, almost every kingdom had its own spelling rules, which of course had an effect on the spoken language as well... the more people could read and write, the more influence from a standardized grammar.
Ralf:
About 500 B.C. the first vowel shift in German language caused an assimilation of several languages or better dialects and adopted various expressions to refer to one and the same term. So it is not unlikely that various expressions had been used to refer to the German language.
Oh no no... shifts usualy do the opposite: They separate languages.
The first consonant shift (about 2000 B.C.) separated the Germanic languages from the Indogermanic group.
You can still see these changes when you compare a language that didn't participate in this shift to another one which did, e.g. Latin and English:
The Germanic "f" corresponds to the Indogermanic "p", e.g.:
Latin:
"pater" ---> Englisch:
"Father".
The 2nd consonant shift (about 6th century) excluded the High-German language from all the other Germanic languages.
A Germanic "
p" turned to either "
pf" or "
ff" in High-German, e.g.:
English and Low-German:
Ape ---> High-German:
Affe
English
pound, LG:
Pund ---> HG:
Pfund
A Germanic "
t" turned to either "
ss" or
"(t)z" in High-German, e.g.:
English, LG:
Water ---> HG:
Wasser
English
heat ---> HG:
Hitze
A Germanic "
k" shifted to "
ch" in High-German:
English, LG:
Milk ---> HG:
Milch
(---> Just take a dictionary and look several words up yourself, you'll see there are thousands of words where you can notice these shifts).
Ralf:
One of the larger tribes had been called the 'Teutons', who unmistakably gave rise to 'teutonic' and the related adjectives 'teutsch' (mediaeval) and 'deutsch' or 'te desca' (italian), while 'german' is of Latin origin. By the way, as far as I know, the Teutons settled across northern and northwestern Europe (Scandinavia, Great Britain).
Tede:
As far as the origin of the word Deutch and Deutchland, the Teutons and Charlemagne (Karl der Grosse in German, or "Karl the Big Guy") had a lot to do with it. The Teutons threated the Roman Empire 113-101 BC, they called themselves "teutonisch", from which "deutch" is a derivative. Karl der Grosse started using this word and spreading it's popularity.
I have to disappoint you in this case, Ralf and Tede
--> Deriving "deutsch" from "teutonisch" is
volksetymologisch and not correct.
The term "
deutsch" is derived from the Gothic adjective
þiutisc, an adjective of the noun
þiuda, which means "Volk, the people".
"
deutsch" simply means "völkisch, zum Volk gehörig = belonging to the people".
The Germans (="Die Deutschen") therefore are the only people in the world that named itself after the
language they speak, not the tribe they belong to.
"deutsch" referring to the language was first mentioned as
theotisce by Otfried von Weißenburg, a scholar of Karl der Große, in the 8th century:
Cur scriptor hunc librum theotisce dictaverit.
(=Why this book is written in German).
---> Otfried wrote a Gospel book in German and he had to declare and explain to the bishop why he has written the book in "theotisce" (= the language of the people), and not in Latin which would have been the more appropriate language for Gospels that time. This declaration of course had to be in Latin though, anyway, Otfried used "theotisc" to have an expression separated from the Latin "germanicus".
Bye for now

-MrMagoo