wiele pokoi

pacadansc

Senior Member
English
Hello to all,
In the sentence,
" Ten hotel ma wiele ładnych pokoi" ,
pokoi seems to be in the genitive rather than the accusative case.
Is this sentence correct? If so, why would pokoi be in the genitive form?
Dziękuję !
 
  • jasio

    Senior Member

    Poland91pl

    Senior Member
    Polish
    Yes, as the previous speakers stated above - both forms are correct, however, to me, "pokojów" sounds awkward to me. I would probably say "ten hotel ma wiele pokoi "
     

    pacadansc

    Senior Member
    English
    Yes, as the previous speakers stated above - both forms are correct, however, to me, "pokojów" sounds awkward to me. I would probably say "ten hotel ma wiele pokoi "
    Thank you. It is interesting to know that both are acutally used. Perhaps a regional difference? or generational? I do see that wiktionary offers both without any preference noted.
     

    Ben Jamin

    Senior Member
    Polish
    For me "pokojów" sounds old fashioned and even a little weird, I always say "pokoi" when I speak about 'rooms', but "pokojów" when I speak about 'peace' in plural.
     

    Ben Jamin

    Senior Member
    Polish
    Is this sentence correct? If so, why would pokoi be in the genitive form?
    Dziękuję !
    You always use genitive after collective qualifiers like "wiele" (many), "mnóstwo" (plenty), "szereg" (a set of), "grupa" (group) and similar, and all numerals bigger than 4 (5 to 21) and all numerals not ending in a digit from 2 to 4.
     

    Marco de Varsovia

    Member
    polish
    Thank you. It is interesting to know that both are acutally used. Perhaps a regional difference? or generational? I do see that wiktionary offers both without any preference noted.
    General rule is "ów".
    strój - strojów
    nabój - nabojów
    słój - słojów
    wuj - wujów
    But in the coloquial language sometimes is possible to say, ending the words with "i", but only a few of them, which is the older form.
    In Poland nearly everybody says "pokoi".
     

    Ben Jamin

    Senior Member
    Polish
    But in the coloquial language sometimes is possible to say, ending the words with "i", but only a few of them, which is the older form.
    In Poland nearly everybody says "pokoi".
    It is actually the other way round. The ending with '-i' is new. It is a projection of the regular ending of the singular and plural of the feminine nouns ending with '-ja', like zbroja/ zbroi.
    That's why the form pokoi is only accepted in colloquial language. Note also that only nouns used very often have this form. Besides, it is not used with words denoting persons .
     

    Marco de Varsovia

    Member
    polish
    Nie wiem, czy warto się spierać, ale historycznie "j" było miękkie. Z tego powodu mówiono np. odetchni, a nie odetchnij (odpocznij). Dodanie na końcu miękkiego "j" nie miało sensu. Chcąc natomiast by brzmiało twardo, dodawano "y" i tworzyła się końcówka "yja" (refleksyja) w mianowniku lub "yj" (reflaksyj) w dopełniaczu. Z tego okresu pochodzi dopełniacz pokoi (słoi, stroi).
    Z biegiem czasu "j" twardniało i zaczęło być wymawiane tak, jak obecnie. Zaczęliśmy mówić "odpocznij" z wyraźnie słyszalnym, stwardniałym "j" na końcu czy "refleksji" z wyraźnie słyszalnym "j" w środku. Twarde "y" przestało być potrzebne i zniknęło. To stwardniałe "j" zamienia się w dopełniaczu na "ów". Jest to forma młodsza.
     

    Ben Jamin

    Senior Member
    Polish
    Nie bardzo wiem, czy można porównywać zmiany w końcówkach rzeczowników i czasowników według tych samych reguł.
    Poza tym trzeba popatrzeć na aspekt czasu. Te formy, o których piszesz są bardzo stare i raczej całkowicie zapomniane, natomiast przejście z "-ów" na "-i" jest całkiem nowe (XX wiek).
     
    < Previous | Next >
    Top