ya (placement)

Masood

Senior Member
British English
Is it generally the rule that 'ya' is placed at the beginning of a sentence, when you want to say 'already' or 'by now'?

e.g.
You should be used to it by now=ya deberías estar acostumbrado
I've already asked him=ya le he pedido a él

Are these ok, or are they wrong?

Thanks
Masood.
 
  • lizy

    Senior Member
    Spain-Spanish
    Tus frases son correctas, Masood.
    Tienes razón al decir que "ya" suele ir al principio de la frase, pero también es frecuente encontrarlo al final. En este último caso, puede que el "ya" resulte más expresivo o indique más urgencia, pero las diferencias de matiz (si existen) son muy leves.
    Otros ejemplos:
    ¿Ya han llegado?
    ¿Han llegado ya?
    Ya tendrían que estar aquí.
    Tendrían que estar aquí ya.
     

    jmx

    Senior Member
    Spain / Spanish
    Masood said:
    Is it generally the rule that 'ya' is placed at the beginning of a sentence, when you want to say 'already' or 'by now'?

    e.g.
    You should be used to it by now=ya deberías estar acostumbrado
    I've already asked him=ya le he pedido a él

    Are these ok, or are they wrong?

    Thanks
    Masood.
    They are OK. But others can be correct too :

    deberías estar acostumbrado ya
    le he pedido a él ya
    deberías ya estar acostumbrado (less common)
    le he pedido ya a él (less common)

    Anyway, instead of "ya le he pedido a él" it is better something like "ya se lo he pedido a él". For some reason, the verb "pedir" sounds better when any direct object is mentioned, in this case "lo".
     

    Masood

    Senior Member
    British English
    Thanks, both of you. Probably "ya se lo he pedido a él" sounds better than "ya le he pedido a él" because in the latter case "le" and "he" blur into one another to sound like "le" on its own...just a wild guess.

    It's a bit like "se lo compraré" instead of "le lo compraré" (I'll buy it for him).
    This is pure guesswork on my part!

    Masood
     

    crom

    Senior Member
    Spain
    Masood said:
    Is it generally the rule that 'ya' is placed at the beginning of a sentence, when you want to say 'already' or 'by now'?

    e.g.
    You should be used to it by now=ya deberías estar acostumbrado
    I've already asked him=ya le he pedido a él

    Are these ok, or are they wrong?

    Thanks
    Masood.
    In Spanish, the order of a word is more flexible than in English. In the first sentence you could say:
    ya deberías estar acostumbrado
    deberías ya estar acostumbrado
    deberías estar ya acostumbrado
    deberías estar acostumbrado ya

    In the second sentence you could say:
    Ya le he preguntado (verb pedir needs a direct object)
    Le he preguntado ya

    "Please, correct me"
    crom
     

    garryknight

    Senior Member
    UK, English
    crom said:
    In Spanish, the order of a word is more flexible than in English.
    But there is one situation in which you might want to make sure you get it right. If you're in a café and you want tea, you'd usually want the word order to be: "Quiero té". ;)
     

    crom

    Senior Member
    Spain
    garryknight said:
    But there is one situation in which you might want to make sure you get it right. If you're in a café and you want tea, you'd usually want the word order to be: "Quiero té". ;)
    The words and te are not the same. is the drink, but te refers to a person, so you could say "Té quiero" that is the same as "Quiero té". But "Té quiero" is very poetic and not used. Don't confuse with "Te quiero"="I love you".

    If somebody doesn't agree with me, I would like him/her to explain his/her point of view.

    crom
    "Please, correct me"
     

    garryknight

    Senior Member
    UK, English
    Yes, crom, I know that and te are not the same. Not unless you say them out loud or leave the accent off one of them. Anyway, a joke explained loses its effect. :rolleyes:
     

    crom

    Senior Member
    Spain
    garryknight said:
    Yes, crom, I know that and te are not the same. Not unless you say them out loud or leave the accent off one of them. Anyway, a joke explained loses its effect. :rolleyes:
    Ok, ok :D It could be an embarrassing situation in a Café, of course :)

    crom
    "Please, correct me"
     

    LadyBlakeney

    Senior Member
    Spain
    Masood said:
    Thanks, both of you. Probably "ya se lo he pedido a él" sounds better than "ya le he pedido a él" because in the latter case "le" and "he" blur into one another to sound like "le" on its own...just a wild guess.

    It's a bit like "se lo compraré" instead of "le lo compraré" (I'll buy it for him).
    This is pure guesswork on my part!

    Masood
    Masood, not wild at all! That is exactly the reason why. :thumbsup:
     

    Artrella

    Banned
    BA
    Spanish-Argentina
    crom said:
    The words and te are not the same. is the drink, but te refers to a person, so you could say "Té quiero" that is the same as "Quiero té". But "Té quiero" is very poetic and not used. Don't confuse with "Te quiero"="I love you".

    If somebody doesn't agree with me, I would like him/her to explain his/her point of view.

    crom
    "Please, correct me"

    Crom, don't we need a comma there "Té, quiero"?? And I agree with you, this is not everyday speech.
     

    tonuco

    Senior Member
    Español (de España)
    Masood said:
    Is it generally the rule that 'ya' is placed at the beginning of a sentence, when you want to say 'already' or 'by now'?

    e.g.
    You should be used to it by now=ya deberías estar acostumbrado
    I've already asked him=ya le he pedido a él

    Are these ok, or are they wrong?

    Thanks
    Masood.
    Hola a tod@s

    Se podría decir?

    You should be already used to it

    Gracias
    Alex
     

    crom

    Senior Member
    Spain
    Artrella said:
    Crom, don't we need a comma there "Té, quiero"?? And I agree with you, this is not everyday speech.
    I wasn't sure of this, but now I think you are right. Thanks

    crom
    "Please, correct me"
     

    jmx

    Senior Member
    Spain / Spanish
    Masood said:
    Thanks, both of you. Probably "ya se lo he pedido a él" sounds better than "ya le he pedido a él" because in the latter case "le" and "he" blur into one another to sound like "le" on its own...just a wild guess.

    It's a bit like "se lo compraré" instead of "le lo compraré" (I'll buy it for him).
    I'm really sorry to disagree with Lady Blakeney twice in a week, but that is not the reason. The reason is that the verb "pedir" needs a direct object, as Crom has confirmed in #5. If the reason were that "le" and "he" fuse as we speak (which is true), we would have to re-invent spanish altogether. That situation happens about 10 times a minute in normal speech.

    Yes, crom, I know that and te are not the same. Not unless you say them out loud or leave the accent off one of them.
    Even though "te quiero" and "té quiero" sound similar, and certainly the latter could create misunderstandings, they do not sound the same. The difference is in the stress with which "té" and "te" are pronounced.
     
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